does NEC require you to install electrical power in detached garage?

[Joethemechanic]

so after 50 years of paying premiums claims can be denied for hazardous defects.

Insurance companies are really slippery. Try to turn that around on them. If you say you took my money for 50 years, but were going to deny any claim for those 50 years because of an existing defect,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Then, did they really provide you with anything?

 

[gadfly56]

Insurance companies are really slippery. Try to turn that around on them. If you say you took my money for 50 years, but were going to deny any claim for those 50 years because of an existing defect,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Then, did they really provide you with anything?

To add insult to injury, usually the best outcome you can expect is a refund of your premiums.

 

[Joethemechanic]

To add insult to injury, usually the best outcome you can expect is a refund of your premiums.

Yeah, and the chances of that are ultra slim.

 

[ericsarratt]

I think the building department may simply be misinterpreting the rule.

JAP>

Yep!

My 2 cents: I would contact your States Department of Insurance, or whoever it is that over the building codes for your State--the agency that adopts them. Then confirm YOUR interpretation of the NEC with them.

Alternatively, contact the NFPA and ask them for an interpretation of the NEC for that section.

I normally email. Then I also call and tell them about my email. If they call back and answer my question, I will email them again and ask them to confirm my understanding so I have something in writing. I always save emails like this for future level headed professional arguing.

 

[Joethemechanic]

To add insult to injury, usually the best outcome you can expect is a refund of your premiums.

This guy should have been in insurance

 

[ron v]

Success!!
I went down to the permit office. I explained to the lady at the front desk that I my permit was held up because the website said I did not put an Electricain on the project declaration form. I told her I spoke with someone from the office and they said the NEC said I must run a branch circuit to the garage.
I told her I looked up the code and talked to several electricians and the code was only saying I had to install
outlets IF the garage had power....
She was very understanding and listened to everything I said. Then she said that none of the plan reviewers were there today, but she would go in the back and see who she could find. Few minutes later she came back and said she talked to the electrical and plumbing guys and they agreed I did not have to run power to the garage.
So she logged into the permit system and cleared the hold on my permit....

Thanks to everyone who pointed out what the code actually means..
I had copies of the enhanced code from the online version ready to boost my case, but I didn't need it.

Now I can move forward and try to find a concrete guy that is not so busy they will answer the phone...LOL

 

[gadfly56]

Success!!
I went down to the permit office. I explained to the lady at the front desk that I my permit was held up because the website said I did not put an Electricain on the project declaration form. I told her I spoke with someone from the office and they said the NEC said I must run a branch circuit to the garage.
I told her I looked up the code and talked to several electricians and the code was only saying I had to install
outlets IF the garage had power....
She was very understanding and listened to everything I said. Then she said that none of the plan reviewers were there today, but she would go in the back and see who she could find. Few minutes later she came back and said she talked to the electrical and plumbing guys and they agreed I did not have to run power to the garage.
So she logged into the permit system and cleared the hold on my permit....

Thanks to everyone who pointed out what the code actually means..
I had copies of the enhanced code from the online version ready to boost my case, but I didn't need it.

Now I can move forward and try to find a concrete guy that is not so busy they will answer the phone...LOL

Some days, you DO get the bear. Glad to hear it went well. Even gladder to hear there are reasonable people out there.

 

[ron v]

Some days, you DO get the bear. Glad to hear it went well. Even gladder to hear there are reasonable people out there.

when dealing with government bureaucracy, I found having a like luck to talk to the right person at the right time usually is what gets you the best results.....

 

[gadfly56]

when dealing with government bureaucracy, I found having a like luck to talk to the right person at the right time usually is what gets you the best results.....

"...a simple rule that great men know by heart,
it's smarter to be lucky than it's lucky to be smart..."

 

[Wishiknew]

Power is not required period.

 

[kwired]

800 years ago.... aren't you afraid you're about due? (;

Who knows, could be millions of years before any more activity, could be tomorrow.

 

[kwired]

A septic tank is just a tank. A leachate field is just one way to handle the outflow. Mine has a filtration system on the discharge.

some are nothing more than a tank and get pumped out when nearing full.

Others are a a tank that operate "full" incoming waste water entersfrom one end. The outlet is on opposite end and usually feeds to some sort of drain field. It lets out same amount of water as what comes in of content that has been broken down in the tank by bacterial action in the tank.

 

[kwired]

the Big Island has a lot of old cesspools. A cesspool is just a hole with the bottom open. They found that the ocean is getting contaminated from all the old cesspools because lava rock is gnerally porus. You can't dig a well, because it would get contaminated from your neighboors cesspools. So several years ago they outlawed any new cesspools and they passed a law that all cesspools need to be convert to septic systems before 2040.

I have done a little research on septic systems. There are several types. Not all need a leach field. But that would be a topic for the pluming forums...LOL

Probably a system that has further treatment in the system than what you typically see in systems that go from tank and then fairly directly to drain field. Soil around here is usually good for those systems. In their percolation testing they don't want to see something that drains down too fast, but also don't want to see it be too slow.

 

[hillbilly1]

I was being a bit facetious.
Since I live amongst the Amish communiities in Indiana. They all have solar pannels on their garage or horse barn. They're not supposed to keep their cell phones in the house. So they charge them in the out building along with the battery for the flashers on their buggies.

In Ohio, they use diesel engines to run their sawmills! My uncle ran an automotive repair shop, and would rebuild the alternators and starters on the engines. They would buy ice cream for special occasions, and keep it in his freezer since they didn’t have refrigeration. Haven’t seen any with solar panels, or they keep them out of sight from the road.

 

[mtnelect]

We always had septic tanks (cesspools) in the Crescenta Valley, until the nitrate levels were getting too high and polluting the freshwater wells maintained by the Crescenta Valley County Water District. So, they applied for federal grant for a septic system and got it approved, but it only covered 50% of the work. The other 50% a bond on our property taxes. But it was worth it, the freshwater wells are now protected. But just incase, we have always subscribed to "Sparkletts" for drinking water.

 

[hillbilly1]

The US government wanted to use chemical deforestation on Forest service land behind us. Many people get their water from natural springs in the area, and it would have contaminated the drinking water for many including myself. Luckily there was enough outrage that they shelved that idea!

 

[Joethemechanic]

In the mid 60's when municipal water and sewer went past our house they assesed by your road frontage. After my grandmother died I was going through her papers and found the assesment bill that he paid. I think it was 120 feet of frontage and it was $3,700 and change. That was serious big money then.

We had family friends who owned a piece of vacant property in the same town, and in the late 90's the father died and while the sons were handling the estate they found that he never paid the assessment on that property 30 ,some years ago. Not sure why, he did own like 10 properties, so maybe it slipped through the cracks. But anyway, the penalties and interest were something astronomical.

 

[drcampbell]

In Ohio, [they Amish] ... didn’t have refrigeration. ...

No absorption (non-electric, no moving parts) refrigeration?

HOW A SERVEL WORKS

Interesting information on the way a Servel makes cold from heat.

vintageservelrefrigerators.com

... Haven’t seen any with solar panels ...

That's a little surprising. I would have expected pretty wide adoption by now.

 

[gadfly56]

In Ohio, they use diesel engines to run their sawmills! My uncle ran an automotive repair shop, and would rebuild the alternators and starters on the engines. They would buy ice cream for special occasions, and keep it in his freezer since they didn’t have refrigeration. Haven’t seen any with solar panels, or they keep them out of sight from the road.

Are we sure we're talking Amish here, and not their theological cousins, the Mennonites?

 

[Buck Parrish]

No absorption (non-electric, no moving parts) refrigeration?

HOW A SERVEL WORKS

Interesting information on the way a Servel makes cold from heat.

vintageservelrefrigerators.com

That's a little surprising. I would have expected pretty wide adoption by now.

All the Amish have solar panels in Indiana. Some small ones some bigger. Their goal is to night depend on the grid. They're required to have flashing lights on the buggies. But even with the lights. They still get hit, ran over and killed.
We had one pulling a trailer full of flowers to sale at the local market. Somebody ran into the back really hard. Killed the wife and two of the kids. the cops shot the horse to put him out of his misery. It was a really bad scene.