Eliminating CFL bulbs, possibly even incandescent

[mbrooke]

Don't eat tuna fish sandwiches. A sandwich with 6 oz of tuna fish has about 48 micrograms of mercury in it. The estimated exposure (what you actually ingest) from a broken CFL is 0.07 micrograms, not the full 4 milligrams.

I don't care for the fact that you can't seem to get 100w equivalent LED's. I like it surgery-suite bright when I'm reading or doing close work. And, I don't believe the longevity claims for LED's after my experience with CFL's. I date my CFL's on the base, and the most I've ever gotten was about 2 years. The last time I purchased lamps for the can lights in the kitchen I got incandescent PAR 38's. Still the best buy on a dollar per lumen basis.

Yes, because elemental mercury is poorly absorbed in the GI tract unlike the mercury compounds found in fish. You could drink a cup worth of elemental mercury and not get sick. But breathing it in as it evpoarate is a whole other story, as well as the phosphorus which absorbs it.

One time exposure from a broken bulb? Yes its certainly not the 3-5 milligrams under any stretch, but do you really want a pall point pen sized blob in your carpet giving of mercury fumes 24/7? That exposure adds up past the touted one time exposure claims.

 

[brantmacga]

That horse already left the barn a while ago, CFL is dying rapidly and all manufacturer R&D effort is 100% LED now. The CFL market is limited to lamp and ballast replacement now for existing installations, there certainly is no new CFL being installed anymore.

I've been shopping new houses in my town. ALL of them are using CFL BR30 lamps in their recessed lighting, and in 5000k no less. Looks absolutely terrible. Residential wiring here is pure crap.




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[jeff48356]

I've been shopping new houses in my town. ALL of them are using CFL BR30 lamps in their recessed lighting, and in 5000k no less. Looks absolutely terrible. Residential wiring here is pure crap.

I actually prefer 5000K lighting, but NOT with CFL's by any means. I love the 5000K (daylight) LED lighting. At least I can see the true color of my clothing in the morning, and will never mistake black for navy again. It's hard to tell the difference under incandescent lighting.

 

[peter d]

I've been shopping new houses in my town. ALL of them are using CFL BR30 lamps in their recessed lighting, and in 5000k no less. Looks absolutely terrible. Residential wiring here is pure crap.

My mom's house in Florida had the same thing. I took them all out and replaced them with regular incandescent ones.

 

[mbrooke]

I've been shopping new houses in my town. ALL of them are using CFL BR30 lamps in their recessed lighting, and in 5000k no less. Looks absolutely terrible. Residential wiring here is pure crap.




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We all have our like and dislikes, but I'm voting >

 

[JFletcher]

CFLs do reasonably well if left on 24/7, like hotel hallway sconce lights and lobby flood lamps. There were about 25 Panasonic CFL floods (very expensive, ~$22ea) in there when I started in 2005, 2.5 years later when I left only 1 had burned out, and they werent new when I started. ~20,000+ hour average life. Stick them in a bathroom vanity where they get cycled 30x a day, or outdoor in cold weather, and they are garbage, never warming up all the way and gypsy moth lifespans. I've only ever seen one melt, a Sylvania 60W equivalent. Those twist bulbs cannot be removed with a pole changer either unless you enjoy a glass, phosphor and mercury shower.

Those quartz tungsten bulbs you find in older outdoor lighting, shop stand/portable lights, and some floor lamps are fire hazards that destroy the fixtures/wiring with heat very quickly. They do make nice space heater/light combos in cold weather. I dont think I've seen any of these older than about 10 years old that havent melted the high temp wire, sockets, or badly damaged the glass/gaskets. The bulbs are expensive and have terribly life expectancy. Put one in an energized luminaire and you'll be seeing lines for hours and be missing fingerprints.

I still prefer incandescents where they will be switched a lot, but most everything else, LED all the way.

For areas where it is legal, do grow rooms still use mainly HPS?

Those T-5 fluorescents have great output and lower cost than LED fixtures tho the bulb flex when changing them is seriously unnerving, and broken bulbs are not uncommon.

 

[curt swartz]

I actually prefer 5000K lighting, but NOT with CFL's by any means. I love the 5000K (daylight) LED lighting. At least I can see the true color of my clothing in the morning, and will never mistake black for navy again. It's hard to tell the difference under incandescent lighting.

Your statement is actually backwards. High color temperature LED/CFL lighting might be closer to the color of daylight but their color rendering index is very bad.

Most of the LED lighting I use is 2700 but some fixtures (UCL's, decorative) only come in 3000. I don't use anything with the CRI less than 90.

 

[hbiss]

I went to my local hardware store the other day looking to replace a 25W incandescent in a table lamp that had burned out. Expecting to find a small CFL I was surprised to be told that they no longer carry CFLs, only LEDs. Ok, but they didn't have anything smaller than a 40W equivalent. So I had to go with an incandescent 25W again.

-Hal

 

[ptonsparky]

Do they make an LED with the G2 base? Dining area fixture with CFL.

 

[ronaldrc]

Do they make an LED with the G2 base? Dining area fixture with CFL.

Whats a G2 base?

Ronald

 

[ptonsparky]

Err ah GU24:ashamed1:

No wonder I couldn't find them.

 

[ronaldrc]

Err ah GU24:ashamed1:

No wonder I couldn't find them.

Well I googled that socket : Thanks

 

[brantmacga]

Eliminating CFL bulbs, possibly even incandescent

Err ah GU24:ashamed1:

No wonder I couldn't find them.

We do mostly commercial, and almost every pendant we install uses a GU24 LED lamp...... maybe to keep people from stealing them ???? Or maybe it's easier to maintain.... less chance of a broken base and a service call.


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[ronaldrc]

We do mostly commercial, and almost every pendant we install uses a GU24 LED lamp...... maybe to keep people from stealing them ???? Or maybe it's easier to maintain.... less chance of a broken base and a service call.


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Know I really didn't no what they where untill I googled them.

Must be fairly new in my 40 some years I never run across one

Thanks

 

[ptonsparky]

To qualify for some energy rating my house had to have a certain # or %, or some such, of the lighting be energy saving. The dinning room fixture was the easiest way to comply, IIRC.

 

[brantmacga]

To qualify for some energy rating my house had to have a certain # or %, or some such, of the lighting be energy saving. The dinning room fixture was the easiest way to comply, IIRC.

My city requires 50% of fixtures have energy efficient lamps, and every fixture counts as 1 no matter how many lamps in that fixture.


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[user 100]

3-10 milligrams is not a trace amount. In my world trace amounts would be the normal background levels of mercury found in the environment. ........

Don't eat tuna fish sandwiches. A sandwich with 6 oz of tuna fish has about 48 micrograms of mercury in it. The estimated exposure (what you actually ingest) from a broken CFL is 0.07 micrograms, not the full 4 milligrams.......

The problem with the mercury in CFL's isn't so much the small amount per bulb, it is the cumulative effect of all that mercury from the billions of those CFLs installed during the past 15 years or so- all of that has to go somewhere. Most people simply throw them in the garbage w/ out a second thought.

OTOH, we have probably reduced overall mercury emissions from coal pps b/c of these bulbs being more energy efficient, but still we have all these bulbs to get rid of- thankfully, CFLs have turned out to be transitional product and are being replaced by something better.

Another irritation (as mbrooke pointed out) w/ CFLs is the way some have acted when they reach the EOL. There have been folks convinced that they had serious problems w/ their wiring b/c of the odor (the classic iodine-like smell that penetrates everything) and even smoking that has happened when these bulbs croak.

 

[Electric-Light]

where LED's last indefinitely

Wrong. The seriously biased presentation sounds like you're an LED fan boy. In general, it is true that LED activated solid state fluorescent lamps (LEDs hereafter) will replace CFLs. The biggest reason is the light from parts of CFL that emit light inwards becomes trapped and wasted.

CFL's have a laundry list of negatives, and no advantages anymore over LED's, making them completely obsolete. These include:

1) They contain mercury.
Fair.
2) They do not turn on instantly to full brightness.
Fair.
3) They are not dimmable. (Some are, but they cost a lot more than dimmable LED's)
Debatable. LEDs are not sensitive to high crest factor. Dimmable LED ballsts almost alway have far more flicker content than dimmable CFL ballasts.

4) They break easily, leaving traces of mercury around
Plenty of LED lamps are shatterable.

5) They still get hot, like an incandescent bulb
As do LEDs.

6) They burn out quickly, especially when turned on/off frequently
Fair point. Programmed start CFLs do exist and they're the norm for external ballasts and do not suffer from short cycles like standard CFL, but it takes 1 to 1.5 seconds to turn on.

7) They cause premature failure of neon lights built into illuminated switches.
that is due to interaction between the lamp ballast and in-line switchwhich is used for both LEDs and CFLs.

There are many LED lamps today that have been downspeced to just over 10,000 hrs of life which is about the same with CFL's rated life.
Earlier LEDs strongly emphasized 50,000 or 100,000 hrs as it was impossible at the time to lower cost and had to justify initial cost with lower dollar per 10,000 claimed useful hours.

 

[mbrooke]

Wrong. The seriously biased presentation sounds like you're an LED fan boy. In general, it is true that LED activated solid state fluorescent lamps (LEDs hereafter) will replace CFLs. The biggest reason is the light from parts of CFL that emit light inwards becomes trapped and wasted.

Still not a major deal breaker. I know you have a passion for collecting and restoring vintage lighting, but as time goes on LED will outdo everything known today.

 

[Electric-Light]

Are those glass, or plastic?

Well, it looks pretty, but one reason I like the LEDs I have is that they are plastic. You can drop them on a hard floor and they don't break. I'll bet they are great for trouble lights.

The filament tower LED lamps are filled with helium gas which is many times more thermally conductive than air. The heat is effectively spread over the entire bulb. Plastic envelope wouldn't hold the helium charge, so those have to use a traditional design that depends on rear cooled heat sink.

These filament tower lamps use solid state fluorescent lamps made with blue LED stacks inside a phosphor tube. It would quickly burn out in ordinary air.