petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
It may come to going out of business, or adjusting your cost structure to fit the market. If you would prefer to go out of business, that is your choice.
It's tough out there
- Thread starter electricmanscott
- Start date
- Status
It may come to going out of business, or adjusting your cost structure to fit the market. If you would prefer to go out of business, that is your choice.
it's a good thing you are an employee...those aren't the only choices...
When I was 16 years old, I got a job at a tire store.
The job involved changing truck tires....the big ones.
I worked in a empty, asphalt parking lot and my only tools were a sledge hammer, maul and large tire iron.
It was summer and the heat was almost unbearable.
If any of you have ever changed a large truck tire, you know how it was.
Anyway, every afternoon, I looked like I'd been coalmining all day.
One day my girlfriend and her father came by to see about buying some tires for his car.
When he saw me, he came over and asked me if I didn't feel embarassed to have to work so hard and get so dirty every day....
I thought a second and said "not on payday".
I believe that the man had a lot more respect for me after that.
I've never minded working...still don't, and I'll do just about anything if it means having money in my pocket.
I don't mean big money, just what's necessary for me and my family to eat and have a place to live with a few extras.
I'll weather this downturn.....
Why? Because I'm still willing to work, and thankfully I know how to do a lot of things that people will pay to have done.
It seems like a lot of younger people have lost (or never had) a good work ethic.
These are the ones that will really suffer when hard times come around.
It reminds me of a saying that my highschool football coach used to use.
"When the going gets tough, the tough get going"
Just my opinion
steve
The job involved changing truck tires....the big ones.
I worked in a empty, asphalt parking lot and my only tools were a sledge hammer, maul and large tire iron.
It was summer and the heat was almost unbearable.
If any of you have ever changed a large truck tire, you know how it was.
Anyway, every afternoon, I looked like I'd been coalmining all day.
One day my girlfriend and her father came by to see about buying some tires for his car.
When he saw me, he came over and asked me if I didn't feel embarassed to have to work so hard and get so dirty every day....
I thought a second and said "not on payday".
I believe that the man had a lot more respect for me after that.
I've never minded working...still don't, and I'll do just about anything if it means having money in my pocket.
I don't mean big money, just what's necessary for me and my family to eat and have a place to live with a few extras.
I'll weather this downturn.....
Why? Because I'm still willing to work, and thankfully I know how to do a lot of things that people will pay to have done.
It seems like a lot of younger people have lost (or never had) a good work ethic.
These are the ones that will really suffer when hard times come around.
It reminds me of a saying that my highschool football coach used to use.
"When the going gets tough, the tough get going"
Just my opinion
steve
Don't be hard on him, his Phone company may reduce their rates for him, also all his insurance companies, may offer a better deal, if the market slides, and for sure the Utility companies will reduce their rates, and I bet your landlord will lower the rent as soon as he sees the market conditions sliding, no way is he going to hold me to a contract.
Labor is not the only mix in the soup, you really need to be exposed to a business, to see the entire picture.
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- Location
- Simi Valley, CA
Right now the way things are, if they asked me to cut back to 32 hours a week, I would do it in a heart beat if it meant keeping my job.
I've worked on a worm farm, busted out concrete with a sledge hammer for a summer, washed rental cars by hand. When I first got in the trade I was working at Toys-R-Us and I kept that job. I was working 7 days a week including 4 nights during the week, the only day I got off was Christmas. I did that for a year. The father of my girlfriend at the time didn't think to much of me, but the one thing he did say to me was that he was very impressed with my work ethic.
Scrub toilets, deliver pizzas, work as a CIA assasin. As long as I can take care of my family.
I've worked on a worm farm, busted out concrete with a sledge hammer for a summer, washed rental cars by hand. When I first got in the trade I was working at Toys-R-Us and I kept that job. I was working 7 days a week including 4 nights during the week, the only day I got off was Christmas. I did that for a year. The father of my girlfriend at the time didn't think to much of me, but the one thing he did say to me was that he was very impressed with my work ethic.
Scrub toilets, deliver pizzas, work as a CIA assasin. As long as I can take care of my family.
sparkyjim
Member
- Location
- Dallas, TX
Well put. I remember the 70's all too well. I too am fortunate to have skills that customers are willing to trade their currencies for. My oldest is in college; home for the holidays and up with me every morning to go to work (he tells me all day long this is NOT what he is going to do for a living - but I know he has a good skill set, a good work ethic, and will never be hungry)
The next year or two could be very interesting.
Happy Holidays to ya'all and your families
tonyou812
Senior Member
- Location
- North New Jersey
Dont feel bad ito I just did a 150 Amp service change and charged the young fellow 3800 bucks. Do I feel bad? Not even a little bit.The whole job took me about a day to finish, that includes the HO getting the permit for me
And the best thing of all is I had purchased the panel 5 months ago for another job that got cancelled and I am glad to finally get rid of it. What is a fair price? What ever he is willing to pay. Well I had a little inside info in this guy. Apparently a familiy member of his left him a lot of money when he passed away and now the kid is on a spendiding spree. And the best thing of all is I might of talked him into wiring his basement for some nice money. For me its stupid to lower my price just to get work. The simple Dinner Job that I mentioned in another post is enough work to keep me busy for a little over a week. And I will make some good money on that one too not to mention the free meals. I havent lowered my prices yet and really dont intend to. I really consider myself lucky in the fact that I have made some really great contacts. Several GC a Designer and several small buisness owners.
Its funny because someone else mentioned something about how they got a "small" job 50-60 K. I guess its all relative. But Im doing really well with my small stuff and at the moment Im very content.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Of course he was. It kept you away from his daughter. :grin:
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA
Keep in mind that a ditch digger is the only profession where you always start at the top and work your way down.
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA
Keep in mind that a ditch digger is the only profession where you always start at the top and work your way down.
This is true with any trade, but my dad told me once that it didn't matter to him what I did for a living, I could dig ditchs for all he cared, but if that's what I did he wanted me to dig the straightest, deepest ditchs that anyone had ever seen, so that when people wanted a ditch dug I was the first person they thought of.
I thought that those were the most profound words that I had ever heard when I was 16 years old, until I got older and found out that he had paraphased a quote from Martin Luther King Jr. who had expounded on a quote from Abaraham Lincoln, who I'm sure heard it from his father.:grin:
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
I did not say it was the only choice for everyone. But for some people it may be the only choice.
The fact is that if the market dictates a price that is less than what a business is willing to accept, they really only have two choices. One is to go our of business, the other is to find ways to reduce their prices.
Another option is to change your business to sell into a different market segment, but there are only so many people who can do that.
weressl
Esteemed Member
The inability to 'see' multiple choices is a personal limitation, not inherent.
You have properly used the qualifier 'willing'. What one able to accept and willing to accept is a personal choice and does not take into account business model modification. A business that stays stagnant and does not continually revise and adjust itself to the market conditions and economic realities is bound to fail. The other great business success inhibitor is arrogance and personal pride. See GM and company.....
How would you explain the reason of that limitation? Perhaps you can say; 'only a certain number of people need to do that to make that market segment competitive'. There is an inherent difference of personality type of the man who goes to work every day for 8 hours to get paid by somebody else and the entrepreneur who continually searches the horizon fro new opportunities and const improvements of the existing business practices.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
When the market changes, you don't get a choice. Your business model is going to change whether you like it or not. The change might be mild or it might be chapter 11, but it will change.
You can try to shift to different market segments, or change your marketing tactics, but a lot of other people in the same boat as you are looking at doing that too.
If the demand changes and 50% of the market is gone, that is going to have a downward effect on prices and there are some people who will have to leave that market. You can talk a brave game, but there are not many contractors who are not going to be hurt by the current recession. In areas where the buildup was not as insane, it may be less painful. In some areas like CA, it may last a decade.
You can try to shift to different market segments, or change your marketing tactics, but a lot of other people in the same boat as you are looking at doing that too.
If the demand changes and 50% of the market is gone, that is going to have a downward effect on prices and there are some people who will have to leave that market. You can talk a brave game, but there are not many contractors who are not going to be hurt by the current recession. In areas where the buildup was not as insane, it may be less painful. In some areas like CA, it may last a decade.
tonyou812
Senior Member
- Location
- North New Jersey
It only takes one to "change the market" and it causes a domino effect and everyone follows. Im curious if my accountant will accept less for his services now that we are in these trying times or maybe my credit card company will lower my interest rate or better yet maybe I should put my contract draft out for bid and maybe I can get the lawyers to lower their prices too. Next time I go grocery shopping and the cashier tells me that will be $120 Ill tell her how about 95 ? SOme of you guys really kill me and totally make me just want to stay small.
The most I think ill want is maybe another truck on the road. I was told by one of the builders that I work for that my one bid for a job was 3000 more than some other guys. I said to him " hey you should go with them, I wont get offended. You gotta do what you gotta do, but personally I wont work for no profit.
Why should i tie myself up for two weeks and make no money in the end? I was laughing at that because I know for a fact the guy that quoted that much less is not going to make anything. I work to hard to give my services away for nothing. And most of the people that I work for or have done work for really appreciate my fantastic customer service, and my real easy going attitude and spread my name around like a rash.
Yea....... I think small is the way to go. Jerry Maguire had it right in his mission statement. I hate to say this but part of me really loves listening to some of you guys squirm and run around like chickens with no heads. Weak, Weak, Weak, no balls at all and your ruining it for the rest of us.
"Whats that 4000 square foot home with 50 cans ....ill fo it for 10000 grand (and thats a real scenario i went through last week)and ill buy coffee everyday, no ill do it 7500 and free service upgrades for everyone........WEAK.
The most I think ill want is maybe another truck on the road. I was told by one of the builders that I work for that my one bid for a job was 3000 more than some other guys. I said to him " hey you should go with them, I wont get offended. You gotta do what you gotta do, but personally I wont work for no profit.
Why should i tie myself up for two weeks and make no money in the end? I was laughing at that because I know for a fact the guy that quoted that much less is not going to make anything. I work to hard to give my services away for nothing. And most of the people that I work for or have done work for really appreciate my fantastic customer service, and my real easy going attitude and spread my name around like a rash.
Yea....... I think small is the way to go. Jerry Maguire had it right in his mission statement. I hate to say this but part of me really loves listening to some of you guys squirm and run around like chickens with no heads. Weak, Weak, Weak, no balls at all and your ruining it for the rest of us.
"Whats that 4000 square foot home with 50 cans ....ill fo it for 10000 grand (and thats a real scenario i went through last week)and ill buy coffee everyday, no ill do it 7500 and free service upgrades for everyone........WEAK.
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tonyou812
Senior Member
- Location
- North New Jersey
Sorry about the rant but its just irritaiting me to hear what some jobs are going for. If your good at what you do the work will be there regardless of economy. I personally know some of my previous employers treated some of their customers/builders like three legged step childeren when it came to customer service. Now a lot of you guys are working like a bunch of whores. HEY FELLAS good customer service is a year round thing not only for when time are tough. And Marketing doesnt mean a really big supermarket. (lets out a big breath) Ahhh that felt good to get that out.
The packaged food companies have the best ways to adjust, they just lower the weight or size of the package and keep the price the same or lower the price and make the package look bigger.
On sale special 70Amp service, 130Amp or 170Amp service!
Pierre C Belarge
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Tony
I think you need to lighten up some, you do not know the 'shoes' others are walking in.
I think you need to lighten up some, you do not know the 'shoes' others are walking in.
tonyou812
Senior Member
- Location
- North New Jersey
Yea i know i wanted to retract it after but I cant stand people giving their work away for nothing. And i know that its a bit ideaological but if we all stand together we wont have to work like jerks.
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tony, don't retract it...you are correct...
Pierre, i don't care what shoes they are walking in...they have a responsibility to themselves, and to the rest of the trade, to no f it up...if their 'shoes' don't allow them to do the right thing, then they should get new shoes...
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