Job cost?

[jaylectricity]

I just did something similar a few months ago. He had some backstabbed receptacles so he paid me $10 a device plus actual cost of material with minimal markup (Abut $1.10 for TR duplex+ tax). He paid me $5 per receptacle to pull some out, see that they weren't backstabbed and put them back in.

I then did his kitchen, A/C wiring and upgrade service over the last month or so. He was pretty thrifty with his money, so I don't think $11.50 per plug was out of line. I was there for about 6 hours, did a few other things (replace ballast, split his cable tv with compression connectors, replace a light) and made almost $600 past the cost of materials.

 

[macmikeman]

I didn't see any dollar figure attached to the op's post. He just told us about a job he had done. Then another poster came on and explained how he was too slow and procceded to attach a low amount of recompense to the first poster's project. Now if the first poster charged a couple of grand horray for him, cause he knew that for every homeowner who is able to manuver rubes who will later brag about how fast and cheap they are, there are two homeowners who do not bother to look for a second price and therefore he has never ever had to compete with anyone in the first place.

 

[~Shado~]

Honestly, I think you work pretty slowly. You've gotta pick up the pace. Not many people wanna pay $800 bucks for device change. If using "standard" devices on a changeout, I estimate at 5-6 bucks per device.(not including plates) I can average around 60-80 bucks an hour that way. That's giving you about 3-4 minutes per opening, which is plenty of time to changeout a device. I can change out a regular house pretty quickly, even when pigtailing to eliminate backstabs, I can average 60-80 bucks an hour.

Curious where you saw/came up with the $800 figure???

By your $/hr calcs - I came up you billing about $480....yet at $5-$6 per device(and not including plates?)....you are only at $300???

Please shed some light for us not in the know.....

 

[satcom]

These job cost questions come up quite often, it seems we have a lot of EC's out there that need to better their estimating skills, then they can just plug in their pricing, and have a good proposal.

In my opinion using prices as a guide, to answer job cost questions, will never work, we have some guys on here that are in business to earn a decent living and grow business assets so they have sommething to show for their lifes work, and then we have guys that either work part time at it, or are just not running a business but working for wages, and they will always come in with lower prices, and they may net more at times, because they don't have the expenses an operating for profit business has.

 

[~Shado~]

These job cost questions come up quite often, it seems we have a lot of EC's out there that need to better their estimating skills, then they can just plug in their pricing, and have a good proposal.

In my opinion using prices as a guide, to answer job cost questions, will never work, we have some guys on here that are in business to earn a decent living and grow business assets so they have sommething to show for their lifes work, and then we have guys that either work part time at it, or are just not running a business but working for wages, and they will always come in with lower prices, and they may net more at times, because they don't have the expenses an operating for profit business has.

I disagree...having prices posted do several things at once.

1st - It shows others what can be billed/collected...if they are low.

2d - It helps to educate others where they are leaving $$$ on the table.

3rd - As you know there are always folks griping about being under cut. And that prices are all over the board, and how we should follow plumbers and HVAC more.
Yes every EC's overhead is different, and what is needed by one is not needed for another. Yet....they don't want to post prices in order to help get billable $$$/hr UP to a viable average.

4th - Perhaps the poster has figured their cost correctly are suprised/spooked at what is needed and looking for assurance that they are in the ballpark for an area.

5th - Unless we unite a little more and offer up our figures more often....we will never change the publics view...nor stop hammering on other legit EC's for what is percieved as hack prices.

 

[mcclary's electrical]

Curious where you saw/came up with the $800 figure???

By your $/hr calcs - I came up you billing about $480....yet at $5-$6 per device(and not including plates?)....you are only at $300???

Please shed some light for us not in the know.....

$800 was a guess as to how much he had to charge for his time. My point was, if he ACTUALLY had to bid this job, he would have lost it because there's no way that's an all day job,,,,no way,,,unless you make it take all day, which is not fair to the owner. I'm gonna be in and out, and still come in cheaper than him. IMO

 

[~Shado~]

$800 was a guess as to how much he had to charge for his time. My point was, if he ACTUALLY had to bid this job, he would have lost it because there's no way that's an all day job,,,,no way,,,unless you make it take all day, which is not fair to the owner. I'm gonna be in and out, and still come in cheaper than him. IMO

Gotcha boss....thank you
I couldnt wrap my head around the 3 comparisons, as the figures were soo different.

FWIW...all the changeouts I have done within the last decade seem to have averaged about $7-$10 an opening.

 

[satcom]

I disagree...having prices posted do several things at once.

1st - It shows others what can be billed/collected...if they are low.

2d - It helps to educate others where they are leaving $$$ on the table.

3rd - As you know there are always folks griping about being under cut. And that prices are all over the board, and how we should follow plumbers and HVAC more.
Yes every EC's overhead is different, and what is needed by one is not needed for another. Yet....they don't want to post prices in order to help get billable $$$/hr UP to a viable average.

4th - Perhaps the poster has figured their cost correctly are suprised/spooked at what is needed and looking for assurance that they are in the ballpark for an area.

5th - Unless we unite a little more and offer up our figures more often....we will never change the publics view...nor stop hammering on other legit EC's for what is percieved as hack prices.

The problem comes in when someone in a wealth area posts their prices, and someone in a depressed area may be pricing for his local area, if hours were used then it would fit any area.
When they say someone is low balling, are they sure they are not just in a depressed area. and are adjusting to the local area.

I am all for operating at a nice profit, but someone in a depressed area can still be turning a profit at lower prices, but due to material prices, they are not usually that much lower.

 

[macmikeman]

Successful Electrical Contractors-

And the ones who learn how to cut prices down to the bone in order to get all the jobs-

#2 choice makes sure he always gives a "fair" price to the homeowner, without regard to what is "fair" to him or his family.

 

[aline]

What the lowest price can get you.
http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=en-US&brand=msnbc&vid=c435f953-78e0-4716-a6d8-1a57f23b05ae

 

[growler]

$800 was a guess as to how much he had to charge for his time. My point was, if he ACTUALLY had to bid this job, he would have lost it because there's no way that's an all day job,,,,no way,,,unless you make it take all day, which is not fair to the owner.

I would charge more than $800 but they would end up with a top quality job when I'm finished. First of all I make sure the panel is marked correctly as I turn off the individual breakers to work. Then I remove the devices on that circuit and vacuum the debris from the boxes ( old sheetrock mud and saw dust maybe bugs ). Pigtail all devices and then check the circuit when finished for excessive voltage drop and all gounding is correct to make sure there wasn't a problem missed somewhere. All cover plates will be level and any dust cleaned up. I will also make sure that all circuits are protected by the correct breaker size.

I have never stated anywhere that I'm the fastest nor the cheapest and would want anyone to get the wrong idea. If you don't state it then you don't have to live up to it, I promise quality and deliver on that promise.

8 hours may be longer than necessary but that depends on obstacles such as furnature and construction materials, how many boxes are loose and how many screws are stripped. On most older homes I end up needing many box extensions to make sure the receptale is supported and the box not recessed to far into the wall. In michigan it would be a good idea to put seals on all cover plates to block air flow. I would use T/R receptacles because most people either have children or grand-children that visit.

Why not make a day of it and give the guy some value for his money. I don't drive over 60 miles for the fun of it. If all he wants is a cheap change out there is probably a side jobber just down the road from him.

It's all very fair to the customer because I have talked him into letting me check out his electrical system for possible faults. It's a good idea for me because I may find some. Then I get to sell something more. Find that flying splice that's overheating in the wall before it burns the house down.

 

[Rich R]

Is that second pic McClary cleaning out his shop ?

 

[nizak]

FWIW, I billed the job out at $550.00, sure are alot of different view points. Thanks all.

 

[satcom]

FWIW, I billed the job out at $550.00, sure are alot of different view points. Thanks all.

NOW! your ready to start this job
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdLJJL32OdI

I think you can do this on your way back from another job, just work faster.

 

[mcclary's electrical]

Is that second pic McClary cleaning out his shop ?

Watchit,,,,,you don't know me like that

 

[staticcontrol]

I decided not to long ago....that I'm entitled to have a nice day. Part of the reason of having a company of my own was to escape the headless chicken mentality. Hurry up.....hurry up....blah blah...! Put in the effort at work without being a slacker and have a nice day. Why beat the clock all the time. I noticed that in this trade, most electricians start backing down their profit when they notice they actually have a profit. I've seen it.

After they add up the cost of the work, they start to see how to save the customer money. ??????why? Don't rip anyone off,just do the job you know it takes and have a customer for life. I personally have a long way to go with estimating properly but it's on my agenda every day as I study and read in this forum. We really need to band together with pricing. It's ridiculous that I can bid a job and someone will do it for half.

 

[jerrysounds]

I'm at $230.21 for the first device and $50 every device after. So, that comes to $2600.oo and I will make sure all of the connections are correct and plates are level:grin:

 

[shermansfather]

I'm thinking the Electrical trade may be the only folks arguing this.

 

[emahler]

i'm beginning to think that there is a correlation between technical skill and business acumen....i'm thinking they are mutually exclusive...just take a look around the trades...electrical is the most technically demanding, yet, we are full of geeks who don't know how to price...plumbing is fairly simply, hasn't really changed in 100 years, yet, they got their act together on pricing...

rich r, i think your observation is pretty dead on...we are an independent breed, sometimes to a detriment of those we love the most...our family..

carry on...

 

[Dnkldorf]

1 man 6 hrs 125 miles round trip, also picked up material on the way. BTW, this job is located in Northern MI.

This is 6 hrs to change devices, and at least 2 hrs round trip. If the travel time is included in the 6 figure, that leaves 4 hrs to change 50 devices and 50 covers.

This job should sell for over a grand......easy.

I doubt anyone could change all 50 devices and plates in less than 5 hrs, 6 for that matter, on a site unseen job.

Your nuts.