New Blood

[MrMilbank]

I'm 25. you old folks sure do bicker allot about wiring methods. speed + code compliance + clean trucks = my work ethic.

 

[PCN]

Here is yet another perspective.

We are currently building 3 identicle 35k sq ft. facilities, three different regions with three different contractors. All of their bids were very close to one another.
Prior to the bid process there is never discussion of " down and dirty price" or "art work price". ( I realize this does happen on some small jobs) It's just assumed best price for a quality installation.

As the projects are all nearing completion we are seeing quite a "quality" difference between the three. The contractor that has taken the time to do a top notch job will be added to our preferred contractor list. The one that has run his MC so it looks like a rats nest, has sloppy panels and has cut corners at every chance probably won't be used again.

I guess my point is people DO see things in the walls and ceilings before they a covered. Sometimes a little extra effort to be neat might get you that next job.

An interesting side note is the standout companies foreman is about 55 years old.
The not so standout foreman is probably 30.

 

[BDB]

I'm 24 years old, and guess what? I don't mind working hard while doing a neat job! I'm a perfectionist at heart, but I also realize that I can't spend 3 days on a 10' stick of IMC, so that it looks perfect. My own philosophy that I've come up with is "Work as hard as I can, make it look as good as I can, meet the deadline!" The thing is, I know a few guys my age, and most of us share the same mentality, but there really aren't a whole lot of other young guys that I run into. It kinda makes me wonder what's going to happen when the older guys start retiring. Oh well, I guess I'll just work harder:roll:!

 

[ohm]

Here is yet another perspective.

We are currently building 3 identicle 35k sq ft. facilities, three different regions with three different contractors. All of their bids were very close to one another.
Prior to the bid process there is never discussion of " down and dirty price" or "art work price". ( I realize this does happen on some small jobs) It's just assumed best price for a quality installation.

As the projects are all nearing completion we are seeing quite a "quality" difference between the three. The contractor that has taken the time to do a top notch job will be added to our preferred contractor list. The one that has run his MC so it looks like a rats nest, has sloppy panels and has cut corners at every chance probably won't be used again.

I guess my point is people DO see things in the walls and ceilings before they a covered. Sometimes a little extra effort to be neat might get you that next job.

An interesting side note is the standout companies foreman is about 55 years old.
The not so standout foreman is probably 30.

Right on PCN, I've seen what you described... many times. Not only will the sloppy guy never get another job (at any price) I've seen them have to tear out their mess..at their expense, and redo it before they can get the next draw. This has happened on jobs with 300+ "electricians".

 

[brandon2177k]

I'm 25 and I couldn't agree more with BDB. I was raised with a work ethic, and the philosiphy "If you can't find time to do it right the first time, how you gonna find time to do it over." It seems my generation lacks common sense as much as a work ethic. If it ain't the same thing over and over all day they don't get it. They can't pick up whats goin on and run with it. My problem is, the town I grew up in, where I'd like to make my career, where I currently work for an EC, prolly one of the better ones in town, sucks for pay. I, nor my coworkers, haven't seen a raise in two years, or a bonus. I know the economy is rough right now, but really not here in the heartland. Work is always steady. It's hard to keep caring about workmanship when there is no incentive to do so. I know we make the boss good money, If he would kick us a 50 or 100 buck bonus here and there atleast we'd feel like we're appreciated, and morale would go up a little.

 

[GeorgeW]

New blood

New blood

I am 49 and just got my license 1 year ago. I did my apprenticeship part time while I was a professional fire fighter. As an apprentice at the ripe age of 40 something, I hustled and sweat and asked LOTS of questions and learned through a correspondance course while the young ones went to night school and skipped class. I was blessed to work under a Master Electrician my same age who challenged me everyday. If it weren't for him, I would not have the knowledge I do today. As for the wires as the crow flies...NOT ON MY JOB! The code does state 'workmanship like manner'. Make it look like you gave a damn.

 

[DonP520]

One thing that has been over looked is in the NEC 110.12 Mechanical Execution of Work.
Electrical equipment shall be installed in a neat and workmanlike manner.(accepted industry practices are described in ANSI/NECA 1-2006, Standard Practices for Good Workmanship in Electrical Contracting) Then again I think the labor pool for TX is south of the border wheather we like it or not.

 

[Teaspoon]

you can be code compliant and still be sloppy ,code is MINIMUM standards."neat and workmanlike" can be inforced its known as "you'r fired"

I have to agree with this.You're fired would solve a lot of the sloppy work.
I under stand that it can be code compliant and not be a neat install.
This is where pride in workmanship has went down the tubes.
But Cheap people are the cause of the poor workmanship.
Cheaper is seldom ever better, Cheaper usually leads to sloppy/non code compliant installs. The E.C. has to take to many short cuts to survive.

 

[satcom]

I have to agree with this.You're fired would solve a lot of the sloppy work.
I under stand that it can be code compliant and not be a neat install.
This is where pride in workmanship has went down the tubes.
But Cheap people are the cause of the poor workmanship.
Cheaper is seldom ever better, Cheaper usually leads to sloppy/non code compliant installs. The E.C. has to take to many short cuts to survive.

Why would anyone lower their standard to provide a cheap price, I my opinion they may be beter off finding another line of work, or try ask for what they are worth, and to work for those willing to pay.

 

[wawireguy]

Here is yet another perspective.

We are currently building 3 identicle 35k sq ft. facilities, three different regions with three different contractors. All of their bids were very close to one another.
Prior to the bid process there is never discussion of " down and dirty price" or "art work price". ( I realize this does happen on some small jobs) It's just assumed best price for a quality installation.

As the projects are all nearing completion we are seeing quite a "quality" difference between the three. The contractor that has taken the time to do a top notch job will be added to our preferred contractor list. The one that has run his MC so it looks like a rats nest, has sloppy panels and has cut corners at every chance probably won't be used again.

I guess my point is people DO see things in the walls and ceilings before they a covered. Sometimes a little extra effort to be neat might get you that next job.

An interesting side note is the standout companies foreman is about 55 years old.
The not so standout foreman is probably 30.

Problem is that the guy that did the crappy work will get a low ball bid on someone elses job. Why not shop for quality in the first place?

 

[K2500]

...Why not shop for quality in the first place?

Not to advocate sloppy work but I think everybody shops for quality, It's just that not everybody can afford that quality. I like Square D, but will install GE if that gets the price into an affordable range for the customer. My level works just as well on either, and they both are listed for for same application.

 

[SEO]

I think that the quality of work follows the economy when the economy is good people will pay a little more for quality and when it's down they look at price closer and not the quality. Some of the younger electricians came on board when the economy was down and that's how they were trained.

 

[Flex]

I would say the older crowd says "Good Enough" more than the younger guys who are hungry to make a name.