Panel box above dryer legal or not

[sweetcav]

I am working on a renovation and rewire of two apartments. The gc has provided a new floor plan and asked me to look over it for any code issues. The big one I saw was the new floor plan has the panel box in the washer dryer closet, I asked him about it and he said just put it high enough the dryer doesn't cover it. Told him I have to check into it, just checking my self to make sure I am right before I tell him we need to move it to other side of wall

 

[infinity]

The panel in the closet is OK but the dryer in front of it is the problem because it's in the required working space.

 

[JDBrown]

Ultimately, it's going to depend on the AHJ (but doesn't everything?).

I've usually seen 110.26 cited in this type of situation. For this same reason, you're not allowed to use the space in front of a panelboard for storage (although I think that's a Fire Code issue as well).

110.26 Spaces About Electrical Equipment. Access and working space shall be provided and maintained about all electrical equipment to permit ready and safe operation and maintenance of such equipment.

I underlined the word "ready" because it could be argued that a dryer, while technically movable, is heavy enough and difficult enough to move that it does not permit ready operation and maintenance of the panel if placed in front of the panel.

110.26(A)(3) Height of Working Space. The work space shall be clear and extend from the grade, floor, or platform to a height of 2.0 m (6-1/2 ft) or the height of the equipment, whichever is greater. Within the height requirements of this section, other equipment that is associated with the electrical installation and is located above or below the electrical equipment shall be permitted to extend not more than 150 mm (6 in.) beyond the front of the electrical equipment.

As can be seen in this section, the working space extends all the way to the floor, not just directly in front of the panel. Again, one could make the argument that the dryer doesn't violate this section because it is movable. However, all the Inspectors I've ever met (which, admittedly, isn't all that many) have agreed that intent is for the space in front of the panel to be clear at all times. It's one thing if you build an electrical closet and then the owner decides to use it for storage -- that's on the owner's head if something goes wrong. But if you build it in such a way that you are requiring the owner to place something (like a dryer) in the panel's working space, then it's on your head.

 

[petersonra]

However, all the Inspectors I've ever met (which, admittedly, isn't all that many) have agreed that intent is for the space in front of the panel to be clear at all times.

So if a panel is in a hallway no one can walk in the working space because it would not be "clear" while someone is walking in front of it?

I am not sure what the intent of the rule ever was, but it has made a ton of money for people who paint yellow lines on floors.

You could always mount the panel on some kind of frame that extends above the dryer so that the front of the panel is in line with the front of the dryer.

 

[JDBrown]

So if a panel is in a hallway no one can walk in the working space because it would not be "clear" while someone is walking in front of it?

I am not sure what the intent of the rule ever was, but it has made a ton of money for people who paint yellow lines on floors.

Okay, perhaps I didn't choose the best words in my post. It's almost like I'm an engineer or something.
Let me try again. The Inspectors I've talked to about the working space in front of electrical equipment all agreed that you shouldn't have to move anything out of the way in order to have the working space. Needing to open a door is okay, and asking someone to step aside is fine, but moving a stack of boxes or a dryer is not. Please note that I'm just repeating what I've been told by Inspectors; I'm sure that if I had an electrical panel inside my house I would have stuff in front of it.

And I quite agree with you about the money to be made painting yellow lines on the floor.

You could always mount the panel on some kind of frame that extends above the dryer so that the front of the panel is in line with the front of the dryer.

I've seen this done when a transformer sticks out too far past the front of a panelboard. It would probably look kind of funny, but I doubt there'd be any question about it meeting Code.

 

[infinity]

Something like this substituting a dryer for the transformer.

 

[JDB3]

As always, something that is unusual, I would get the AHJ approval (in writing) first.

 

[Fulthrotl]

I am working on a renovation and rewire of two apartments. The gc has provided a new floor plan and asked me to look over it for any code issues. The big one I saw was the new floor plan has the panel box in the washer dryer closet, I asked him about it and he said just put it high enough the dryer doesn't cover it. Told him I have to check into it, just checking my self to make sure I am right before I tell him we need to move it to other side of wall

i had a 2' x 2' x 18" deep j box under a panel, and had to
move the panel out from the wall so the face of the panel
was flush with the front of the j box.

 

[sweetcav]

There is no inspection or permits involved because it's an "existing " structure...but they want everything done to code( not slumlords) and will do whatever I tell them needs done. Just gonna have them move panel to other side of wall for ease of access at minimum , when I have to add more that they forgot.

 

[sparkyrick]

A recent service call I had. Panel mounted above a basement toilet. I have no idea how this ever passed any inspection. But given all the stuff I had to correct for a home inspector, I have a feeling it was all done by a handy homeowner and it was never inspected.

 

[Cavie]

Make the dryer not be there for inspection.

 

[qcroanoke]

Make the dryer not be there for inspection.

A voice of reason! Finally!
He can't reject what isn't there.

 

[growler]

I am not sure what the intent of the rule ever was.

If you do electrical service work you will learn the intent of the rule quick enough. It's a good rule because you do need that working clearance.

 

[YourElectricianOC]

If you do electrical service work you will learn the intent of the rule quick enough. It's a good rule because you do need that working clearance.

Indeed. I would do what the GC has asked you to do, and tell him that either the dryer service or the panel has to be relocated.

 

[edlee]

Make the dryer not be there for inspection.

An inspector would have to be blind to miss the dryer vent and gas or 240v hookup.

I hope you were joking!

 

[edlee]

If you do electrical service work you will learn the intent of the rule quick enough. It's a good rule because you do need that working clearance.

I agree with that! I really hate having to work on panels that are boxed in, in cramped locations or have something large and heavy in the way. Over the years I have seen many. It is a safety hazard for us electricians and it can make it more difficult to do good work on the panel.

 

[Cavie]

An inspector would have to be blind to miss the dryer vent and gas or 240v hookup.

I hope you were joking!

Not joking. I know people who do not use a dryer. If it is not there, there is no violation.

 

[growler]

You could always mount the panel on some kind of frame that extends above the dryer so that the front of the panel is in line with the front of the dryer.

I would like to see that, I really would.:happysad:

 

[growler]

I saw the new floor plan has the panel box in the washer dryer closet.

Not joking. I know people who do not use a dryer. If it is not there, there is no violation.

I agree that inspectors let contractors get away with this all the time.

I think that if something is shown on a floor plan it's safe to assume that is the intended use of the space so it's the call of the inspection department.

 

[kwired]

Make the dryer not be there for inspection.

A voice of reason! Finally!
He can't reject what isn't there.

Might want to make it not look like the space is intended for the dryer either.

How about "stackable" units to make working space available for the panel?

I asked him about it and he said just put it high enough the dryer doesn't cover it.

My reply is "I need 30" x 36" free space in front of panel, or inspection fails and we get no power, don't bother asking me to get special permission - I won't get it. You can try all you want to convince inspector otherwise - good luck."