Schuko plug

[mbrooke]

On what side is the neutral on schuko and French pin plugs?


Thanks!

 

[AdrianWint]

I fear that the reason you cant find the answer is that I don't think its defined. A schuko can be inserted either way round into its socket (even thou it does have an earth connection, but this is achieved by a strip down the side, which is identical on both sides). This is one of the many reasons why the french system insists upon double pole switching

 

[fmtjfw]

Schuko as implemented in Germany (and other locations) has no power pin polarity.

As implemented in France, the male grounding pin in the receptacle can provide power pin polarity.

With the French male grounding pin up, hot is left and neutral is right in the receptacle.

 

[PetrosA]

Schuko as implemented in Germany (and other locations) has no power pin polarity.

As implemented in France, the male grounding pin in the receptacle can provide power pin polarity.

With the French male grounding pin up, hot is left and neutral is right in the receptacle.

Do you have any reference for that? In the fourteen years I spent in Europe, I wasn't able to find anyone who could answer that question for me.

 

[mbrooke]

I fear that the reason you cant find the answer is that I don't think its defined. A schuko can be inserted either way round into its socket (even thou it does have an earth connection, but this is achieved by a strip down the side, which is identical on both sides). This is one of the many reasons why the french system insists upon double pole switching

Ok that explains it I was picturing a one way insert design.:lol: In regards, those with a shucko plug, do lamps and fixtures have special sockets?

Do you have any reference for that? In the fourteen years I spent in Europe, I wasn't able to find anyone who could answer that question for me.

Im wondering about the statement as well. If the answer is true its worth gold, since I cant find anything on the French plug either.

 

[fmtjfw]

Do you have any reference for that? In the fourteen years I spent in Europe, I wasn't able to find anyone who could answer that question for me.

http://electricaloutlet.org/type-e

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#CEE_7.2F5_.28French.29.28Type_E.29

French standard NF C 61-314 "Plugs and socket-outlets for household and similar purposes" (which also includes CEE 7/7, 7/16 and 7/17 plugs) defines a round plug with two round pins measuring 4.8 by 19 mm (0.189 by 0.748 in), spaced 19 mm (0.748 in) apart and with a hole for the socket's earth pin. This standard is also used in Belgium, Poland, the Czech Republic, Slovakia and some other countries. Although the plug is polarised, there is no universally observed standard for placement of the line and neutral. However, the Czech standard recommends the line wire to be on the left side when facing the socket. Add to that the French convention changed circa 2002 from nothing particular, to, if the earth pin was at the top then the line hole in the socket would be on the right looking at the socket. However, the socket may not necessarily be installed with the earth pin at the top. Packaging in France of said sockets is normally marked with correct orientation of the cables. Polarised pre fitted plugs on appliances are therefore connected with the brown to the right pin and the blue to the left, the earth being connected to the hole at the "top" of the plug.

I found it on the Internet, it must be true:happysad:

 

[PetrosA]

Ok that explains it I was picturing a one way insert design.:lol: In regards, those with a shucko plug, do lamps and fixtures have special sockets?

Lamps can have special plugs. It's a flat plug that fits in pretty much any outlet in the EU. All it has are two prongs.

 

[mbrooke]

Lamps can have special plugs. It's a flat plug that fits in pretty much any outlet in the EU. All it has are two prongs.

But are they polarized though? If a schuko plug has no standard in polarization then how do they prevent the shell from becoming live?

 

[GoldDigger]

Easy. The shell is not connected to either pin.
The ground connection is on the outside edge of the plug.
It is not allowed to bond either pin conductor in the plug to ground within the load equipment.

Tapatalk!

 

[fmtjfw]

Easy. The shell is not connected to either pin.
The ground connection is on the outside edge of the plug.
It is not allowed to bond either pin conductor in the plug to ground within the load equipment.

Tapatalk!

Huh? That is not the way the German lamps I own are wired. Blue to shell, Brown to center button, green/yellow to metallic parts.

 

[mbrooke]

Huh? That is not the way the German lamps I own are wired. Blue to shell, Brown to center button, green/yellow to metallic parts.

Is the plug polarized? Id hope at least.

 

[PetrosA]

The two-prong, ungrounded plugs are not polarized. On the other hand, most lamp sockets are designed very differently from those we use here in the US. There is no threaded metallic shell. The threaded section is plastic or bakelite with only a small plate or plates to make contact against the base of the threaded part of the lamp.

 

[fmtjfw]

Is the plug polarized? Id hope at least.

NO, German Schuko Plugs and receptacles are not polarized.

 

[mbrooke]

The two-prong, ungrounded plugs are not polarized. On the other hand, most lamp sockets are designed very differently from those we use here in the US. There is no threaded metallic shell. The threaded section is plastic or bakelite with only a small plate or plates to make contact against the base of the threaded part of the lamp.

Ok good to know. Any pics or diagrams?


So from my understanding a Schuko plug can be wired either way since its reversible. As for the French plug which is the clone for the schuko except of a protruding ground pin, does the same still apply? Any hole can be live or zero?

 

[PetrosA]

Ok good to know. Any pics or diagrams?


So from my understanding a Schuko plug can be wired either way since its reversible. As for the French plug which is the clone for the schuko except of a protruding ground pin, does the same still apply? Any hole can be live or zero?

You guys are killin' me

Here are some photos of a "French" style (with grounding pin) IP44 surface mounted 16A/250V duplex inside and out as well as a photo of a medium base lampholder out of a 40 year-old Fos pendant. The duplex is a medium priced, Polish made unit. There are cheaper ones available as well as much more expensive ones. This one probably costs about $4.00.

A German style Schuko would have a ground spring at 12:00 and 6:00 and the two holes would be at 3:00 and 9:00 with no way to control polarity (you could reverse the plug 180 degrees and insert it).

As you can see, there are no markings or color coding on the terminals for the receptacle. The electrician is expected to know not to hook up power to the ground pins . Both the contact strips for L and N have both a copper and tinplate half to them.

The lampholder is typical in that it is two-piece, screws together (it's wired via screw terminals from below) with the lamp contacts on a "floating" plate that gets held in place between the base and threaded tube that you screw the light bulb into.

 

[mbrooke]

You guys are killin' me

Here are some photos of a "French" style (with grounding pin) IP44 surface mounted 16A/250V duplex inside and out as well as a photo of a medium base lampholder out of a 40 year-old Fos pendant. The duplex is a medium priced, Polish made unit. There are cheaper ones available as well as much more expensive ones. This one probably costs about $4.00.

A German style Schuko would have a ground spring at 12:00 and 6:00 and the two holes would be at 3:00 and 9:00 with no way to control polarity (you could reverse the plug 180 degrees and insert it).

As you can see, there are no markings or color coding on the terminals for the receptacle. The electrician is expected to know not to hook up power to the ground pins . Both the contact strips for L and N have both a copper and tinplate half to them.

The lampholder is typical in that it is two-piece, screws together (it's wired via screw terminals from below) with the lamp contacts on a "floating" plate that gets held in place between the base and threaded tube that you screw the light bulb into.

Thanks! Your info is worth its weight in gold!:happyyes:

As for the socket, it takes a standard E27 screw base, am I right on this?

Either way thanks! Not even the Euro forms can give you info like this

 

[PetrosA]

Thanks! Your info is worth its weight in gold!:happyyes:

As for the socket, it takes a standard E27 screw base, am I right on this?

Either way thanks! Not even the Euro forms can give you info like this

No problem. When I have time, I don't mind doing the whole photo thing. I understand how much more info you can get from one photo than from 1000 words...

This socket takes a standard E27 lamp, although the mechanism would be the same for almost any screw-base lamps you'd come across.

I haven't been on any of the euro forums, but I'm thinking maybe they suffer from the same lack of understanding of just how different the basics are from here to there for them to realize that a photo would really be helpful. We tend to take what we see every day for granted and figure everyone else just knows how it is

 

[mbrooke]

No problem. When I have time, I don't mind doing the whole photo thing. I understand how much more info you can get from one photo than from 1000 words...

This socket takes a standard E27 lamp, although the mechanism would be the same for almost any screw-base lamps you'd come across.

I haven't been on any of the euro forums, but I'm thinking maybe they suffer from the same lack of understanding of just how different the basics are from here to there for them to realize that a photo would really be helpful. We tend to take what we see every day for granted and figure everyone else just knows how it is

I would agree. Pics are a huge help, especially when the topic is not something we've ever seen.

 

[AdrianWint]

This socket takes a standard E27 lamp, although the mechanism would be the same for almost any screw-base lamps you'd come across.

I don't think so. I cant find a reference right now, but I seem to remember that our 'ES' lamps don't have the same size thread as your US ones. The difference is only small & you cant really spot it by eye, but I'm sure they are different threads.

(I don't mean the SES or GES, these are easy to spot by eye)

Edit: Found it ....your US lamps are E26 (26mm dia thread) , our European ones are E27 (27mm dia thread) ref: Wiki

 

[mbrooke]

I don't think so. I cant find a reference right now, but I seem to remember that our 'ES' lamps don't have the same size thread as your US ones. The difference is only small & you cant really spot it by eye, but I'm sure they are different threads.

(I don't mean the SES or GES, these are easy to spot by eye)

Edit: Found it ....your US lamps are E26 (26mm dia thread) , our European ones are E27 (27mm dia thread) ref: Wiki

I asked a while back and supposedly E-26 and E-27 lamps are interchangeable socket wise. If I am not mistaken its the hieght more than the actual shell width, hence the interchangeability?