Taped Wirenuts

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76nemo said:
Ya' know, it's OK to debate amongst friends as long as there is no safety issue. As I said in another post, scrambled or sunny side up?

I love any debates. 'Cause either one or thee other is wrong, or we have a good discussion going:wink:

All jokes aside , Have a great weekend nemo , I'm calling it a night.

Carl :)
 
I say tape away if it makes you feel good. I think it takes extra time that could be spent making the boss and me some money : )
 
Many moons ago wire nuts were made out of a ceramic material and didn't have enough "bite" to stay on the connection, so installers chose to add tape to insure the wire nut would stay on. Nowadays the wire nuts that are manufactured really grip and will stay on the splice securely if installed properly. That means you can't try and put 5 # 12's under a yellow wire nut. Although some mfr's will suggest that to do not need to twist the wires (in some cases) before installing the connector I choose to twist the wires so that (in my mind) I will have made a more positive connection that I won't have to go back and find should the splice somehow come apart. If, by chance, I made a bad splice to begin with the tape isn't going to help it stay together. I like the theory about containing any arcing that may occur but if the arcing causes enough heat it will melt the tape anyway.

When I open up a JB in fairly new work today and find tape on wire nuts I start to develop Tourettes Syndrome.
 
mdshunk said:
I agree, but take note of this instruction below. It would be a 110.3(B) violation, I would think, to not tape them in the face of such an instruction:

tapewirenutinstruction.jpg

That instruction must be for those cheapo wirenuts without the spring inside. If I see those hard plastic wirenuts with tape on them I know the handyman was there.
Taping wirenuts is silly at best and is a total waste of labor. Imagine what it would cost to tape a couple of hundred thousand splices.
 
Krim said:
If you're so anti-tape,how do you seal up split bolt splices or tap/splice blocks without mastic and or tape ?

Carl :confused:

Carl,
Gimme a break. The original post, and my post, was about taping wirenuts. I thought that was pretty clear.
 
I do a lot of 100+ year old remodels, and have seen the old stuff soldered and taped, knob and tube, slightly newer ones were bakelight wirenuts with friction tape, that are older than I am and still secure. It seems electricians and especially inspectors are creatures of habit... I still see taped nuts today... I just hate having to unwrap the gooey mess.
 
So, I've read all the posts having to do with taping over wirenuts and many state that it is poor workmanship to do so. The only condition I've seen posted in support of the poor workmanship side is the sticky, gooey residue that is encountered when one un-tapes a connection.
Are there any other reasons why taping wirenuts is considered "poor workmanship"? If so, please list them. :smile:
Please do not cite the following as examples of poor workmanship:
  • Takes too much time
  • Costs too much
Thanks.
 
wbalsam1 said:
Please do not cite the following as examples of poor workmanship:
  • Takes too much time
  • Costs too much
Thanks.


You don't get to ask for an answer then spell out unacceptable answers.:grin:

IMO, tape on wire nuts shows that the person is not confident in their ability to make a good splice.

Now that may not be the case with you (I bet it's not:smile: ) but when I come in behind you I don't know you so when I see that tape I will be worried.

You say that 'too much time', 'cost to much' are not good reasons not to tape. OK.....

Well I have not seen a good answer to why tape will is a good idea or how it makes the installation better.

If the splice is bad, the splice is bad, tape will not 'fix it'

Tape will not 'keep the sparks in' as if there are sparks the heat will melt the tape.

I have seen entire wire nuts melt from poor connections and tape would not have kept that from happening.

So I ask you, how does taping a properly chosen and installed wirenut make the job better?
 
JES2727 said:
Carl,
Gimme a break. The original post, and my post, was about taping wirenuts. I thought that was pretty clear.

Ok JES2727 , I just wanted some clarification from you on the use of tape in the trade in general. No offense intended .

Carl
 
Okay, now we're getting somewhere. ;)

Argumentation in support of visible signs of poor workmanship by observing use of tape:
  • inconfidence on the part of a future workman servicing existing taped connection
  • tape will not withhold the effects of arcing
  • tape will not repair a "bad" splice ( this argument is moot and shouldn't be used on either side of the debate)
  • ?
  • ?
:smile: More substantiation needed.....
 
Krim said:
It doesn't . I guess it's just another bad habit that I personally need to resolve apparently .l

I am not saying that anyone has to stop doing any taping or change what makes them happy about the work they leave behind

I am trying to make people examine what they do so they can decide if they want to keep doing things simply because they have 'always done it that way'.
 
wbalsam1 said:
tape will not repair a "bad" splice ( this argument is moot and shouldn't be used on either side of the debate)..

It's moot becuse you decided it's moot? :confused:

What are you trying to acomplish with the tape? :-? :)
 
mdshunk said:
I agree, but take note of this instruction below. It would be a 110.3(B) violation, I would think, to not tape them in the face of such an instruction:

tapewirenutinstruction.jpg
Great, Now we have instructions for Henry Home Owner!!!! # 4 makes it clear this was packaged for untrained installers.....
 
captaincrab55 said:
Great, Now we have instructions for Henry Home Owner!!!! # 4 makes it clear this was packaged for untrained installers.....
I don't know. I see all sorts of disclaimers, even in commercial fixtures. A CYA thing on the part of the manufacturer, I suppose. This fixture was a Hudson Valley Lighting fixture, and it's not exactly cheap junk. It is a brand that lighting designers sometimes spec only in the higher end homes, hotels, and restaurants.
 
mdshunk said:
I don't know. I see all sorts of disclaimers, even in commercial fixtures. A CYA thing on the part of the manufacturer, I suppose. This fixture was a Hudson Valley Lighting fixture, and it's not exactly cheap junk. It is a brand that lighting designers sometimes spec only in the higher end homes, hotels, and restaurants.

Now I gotta ask a stupid question..... You needed to read the instructions? :grin:
 
Marc, are those instructions in fact 'included in the listing' of the fixture?

I doubt it, and if they are not 'included in the listing' then the instructions are just suggestions. :smile:
 
480sparky said:
Now I gotta ask a stupid question..... You needed to read the instructions? :grin:

LOL Give him a break, he was looking for the proper way to Mega meter the fixture. :grin:


Marc....I am just jealous, I have to get myself a Mega and learn how it can help me.
 
480sparky said:
Now I gotta ask a stupid question..... You needed to read the instructions? :grin:
No, but because I've been a participant on many forums for so many years, I often skim fixture instructions to see if something out of the ordinary jumps out at me. A topic for future discussion or maybe something to plug into a topic someone will bring up at a later time. I have a folder laying next to my computer here with lots of interesting tidbits that can be future thread topics, or might play into something someone will bring up in the future. This instruction, with the taped wire nut diagram, was in that folder. The instruction originally caught my attention because it had a picture of a taped wirenut, and that's somewhat unusual. I pulled it out of the folder and scanned it in when I noticed this topic came up.

For the record, I don't tape wirenuts, except in motors. If you have a specific manufacturer instruction, I don't see that you have much choice. No big deal.
 
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