Thinking about the next guy, running conduit

[Mule]

Do you think its right to block other runs of pipe? yes or no

Im not talking about money, Im talking about workmanship

Do you think its right to "throw in" a installation, just because the customer wants a cheap job? yes or no

Do you think its right to low ball a bid having to do, a un-like workmanship manner? yes or no

Come on guys, this is not rocket science

 

[peter d]

Im not talking about money, Im talking about workmanship

I don't know how you can separate money and workmanship. Actually, I think it's impossible to do so. The budget you have will dictate the level of workmanship put into a job, plain and simple.

The analogy often used is that if a customer wants to pay for a Kia, then they get a Kia. If they want to pay for a Cadillac, then they get a Cadillac.

 

[PCN]

The problem is when you pay the Cadillac price end get a Kia in the end.

 

[mdshunk]

The analogy often used is that if a customer wants to pay for a Kia, then they get a Kia. If they want to pay for a Cadillac, then they get a Cadillac.

Interesting you picked that, in that of all the cars my wife and I own, we have both a KIA and a Cadillac. There's a time and place for both.

 

[Mule]

I don't know how you can separate money and workmanship. Actually, I think it's impossible to do so. The budget you have will dictate the level of workmanship put into a job, plain and simple.

The analogy often used is that if a customer wants to pay for a Kia, then they get a Kia. If they want to pay for a Cadillac, then they get a Cadillac.

So, I take it, your saying
" its alright to block off conduit runs if money is a issue"? or in your words..." the customer didnt want to buy a Caddy"

 

[Sparky555]

I run a lot of conduit (through & around almost everything) & I'm still trying to figure out what constitutes a blocked run. Also, how could I block the next run because I have no idea where that next run is going?

 

[Mule]

I run a lot of conduit (through & around almost everything) & I'm still trying to figure out what constitutes a blocked run. Also, how could I block the next run because I have no idea where that next run is going?

did you read the original post?

 

[peter d]

So, I take it, your saying
" its alright to block off conduit runs if money is a issue"? or in your words..." the customer didnt want to buy a Caddy"

Would I block them off personally? No, not if I could avoid it. But I'm not going to lose sleep over it either if I do. The next electrician will likely own a bender and probably be able to use it, so he won't have any trouble bending around those obstructions.

 

[Mule]

Interesting you picked that, in that of all the cars my wife and I own, we have both a KIA and a Cadillac. There's a time and place for both.

So, who are you cheating? you, or your wife? I did notice you placed your wife first in your verbage, so I'll take it that she drives the caddy...

 

[growler]

Do you think its right to block other runs of pipe? yes or no

Im not talking about money, Im talking about workmanship

Do you think its right to "throw in" a installation, just because the customer wants a cheap job? yes or no

Do you think its right to low ball a bid having to do, a un-like workmanship manner? yes or no

Come on guys, this is not rocket science

Mule you are looking at this job as if the last guy working there was a master electrician and the owner of the company. Most of the time that's just not the case. The guy running the conduit was probably some young journeyman and the guy that he needed to keep happy was his foreman or the company owner. He needed to make money to keep them happy, making money normally means speed.

Yes, they probably did low ball the job because that's how a bid works. They low balled the heck out of it and gave some young electrician a very limited time to finish the job.

Most electrical work is not really done by skilled artisans but by production type electricians. He may have been able to do a better job but would have been fired for his effort if the job had taken to long.

I once had a boss that told me I did great work but not enough off it. I told him where to stick his job and walked off the job. If I had 3 or 4 kids at home that would not have been an option. I was lucky there was plenty of work and found another job the next day. That's not always possible at times you have to go along to get along.

 

[peter d]

Interesting you picked that, in that of all the cars my wife and I own, we have both a KIA and a Cadillac. There's a time and place for both.

What about a Ferrari? Oh wait, you like old man cars.

 

[mdshunk]

So, I take it, your saying
" its alright to block off conduit runs if money is a issue"? or in your words..." the customer didnt want to buy a Caddy"

Yes. You betcha. For instance, they might have bought a KIA, with no provisions for 20" rims. If they had bought a Caddy, they could put 20" rims on later. Workmanship, and the resulatant materials used, is directly proportional to the budget. I can't stress that enough. I've done some pretty ugly stuff that was still compliant. I've also done a lot of really nice work that anyone could be proud of. The nice work is normally plan and spec. The ugly work, more often than not, is design/build. I like to give good/better/best options, whenever reasonably possible. I'd like to do their work at whatever level they'll buy in at. I'll try real hard to sell a Cadillac, but if they'll only bite on a Chevy, then they're getting a Chevy from me. Simple as that. I know you think you're seperating yourself from the competition on quality, and that's okay. Think about this... a guy like me can come into your market area a seperate myself from you on quality and price, whichever one they want (or anything in between). I can't tell you how many time I've had a customer say to me, "So-and-so was really good, but gosh was he expensive". I'm expensive too, but I'm willing to sell at whatever level you're buying. The materials and workmanship just get adjusted.

 

[Mule]

It's apparent that male pride is paramount right now, and that logic is out the window......Im taking my wife for a walk

 

[iwire]

Do you think its right to block other runs of pipe? yes or no

In what situation?

In some situations no, in other situations yes.

Do you think its right to "throw in" a installation, just because the customer wants a cheap job? yes or no

Yes, if it meets both the NEC and the customers expectations without a doubt.

A better question, do you think it is wrong?

Do you think its right to low ball a bid

To be clear I am not a employer, I am an employee. That said I would say any price that we can make a profit from and satisfies the customer is right.

having to do, a un-like workmanship manner?

Please define 'workmanship manner'?

To me a job that meets the NEC and the customers needs has been done in a 'workman like manner'.:smile:



Peace, Bob

 

[mdshunk]

It's apparent that male pride is paramount right now, and that logic is out the window......Im taking my wife for a walk

At some point, your pride in workmanship must succomb to more sound business sensibilities.

 

[big john]

I think this thread is being pretty unfair to Mule.

Nobody has any specifics for any of the jobs he's done. He hasn't demonstrated any cases where meeting his standard of quality amounted to "stealing" from the customer, or examples where his standard of quality has undercut his business thereby making him "not a business man".

If his business concern is to provide a level of quality that he's proud of, that the customer is happy with, and he can still "feed his family and pay his bills" then he is most definitely an effective business man.

-John

 

[Mule]

I'd like to do their work at whatever level they'll buy in at.

Mmmmm.....................

 

[iwire]

It's apparent that male pride is paramount right now,

Yes, was apparent from the opening post.

 

[mdshunk]

If his business concern is to provide a level of quality that he's proud of, that the customer is happy with, and he can still "feed his family and pay his bills" then he is most definitely an effective business man.

BUT... he could be even more effective.

Challenging long-held beliefs is not being unfair at all. It's how people grow, by having what they think is true turned upside-down.

 

[Mule]

I think this thread is being pretty unfair to Mule.

Nobody has any specifics for any of the jobs he's done. He hasn't demonstrated any cases where meeting his standard of quality amounted to "stealing" from the customer, or examples where his standard of quality has undercut his business thereby making him "not a business man".

If his business concern is to provide a level of quality that he's proud of, that the customer is happy with, and he can still "feed his family and pay his bills" then he is most definitely an effective business man.

-John

Thank you....What's your address? so I can send you a $100 ....:smile: