Upcoming mandatory stoppage of all natural gas appliances in houses.

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
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I can only imagine how energy efficient it is to truck in CNG over using a pipeline.

OTOH, when it is cold out and the utility shuts off your NG because it has run out of NG, thank Gov. Cuomo, although by then he may be in prison.
 

hbiss

EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
Location
Hawthorne, New York NEC: 2014
Occupation
EC
We had a bridge across the Hudson carrying the NYS Thruway (I-287) from Tarrytown to Nyack at a place on the river called Tappan Zee that was named by Dutch settlers. It was built in the '50s and opened in '55 and was called the Gov. Malcom Wilson Tappan Zee Bridge for the then Governor. Until that time only ferry service was available season permitting. Only way around was South to one of the City bridges or North to the Bear Mountain. It was a quick hurry-up job due to the Korean war with a lifespan of only 50 years.

In 2013 the Thruway authority began building the new bridge a few hundred feet to the North of the old one. Not a moment too soon, the old bridge was in a bad state of repair. The entire road deck was replaced with precast sections because holes would open up allowing cars going by to see the river 200 feet below. But that was just a band-aid.

The new span opened in 2017 with Andrew naming it after his father without any discussion which pissed people off. It was a replacement at the same place, not a new bridge.

The sections of deck from the old bridge were sold to municipalities who wanted them for $1 each. The bridge became so unstable during demolition that a remaining section had to be demolished with explosives because workers were prohibited from being in it. I remember them abandoning a lot of equipment, just leaving it on the bridge where it was. Compressors, fork lifts, port-potties. On January 15, 2019 it was brought down. I watched it on TV and about 5 seconds later my whole house shook.

-Hal
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
I dont think I can buy that. It is just too much of an oversimplification. There always needs to be peaker plants that are not used often, for record high temperatures, maintenance and shutdowns, etc. There apparently is a market for such things. IF renewables are making some power producers go out of business, that is just the market working. I dont see how that changes peaker operations much. The few problems that have happened, the issue was more with the ISO and record temperatures than the renewables.
With deregulation there is very little authority to require peaker plants, as most generation is no longer owned by the regulated public utilities.
 

oldsparky52

Senior Member
You guys are a lot smarter than I, but all of this diversified production seems like it makes it more important that the homeowner be prepared to generate their own electricity as outages may become more prevalent.
 

retirede

Senior Member
Location
Illinois
You guys are a lot smarter than I, but all of this diversified production seems like it makes it more important that the homeowner be prepared to generate their own electricity as outages may become more prevalent.

And the most common way to do so is to utilize a nat gas generator. Which brings us back to the original topic!
 

garbo

Senior Member
You guys are a lot smarter than I, but all of this diversified production seems like it makes it more important that the homeowner be prepared to generate their own electricity as outages may become more prevalent.
In philly where there has to be over 100,000 row homes so the only operation would be solar. Philly Electric is a joke and for last 100 years most expensive energy supplier in Pa. At an IAEI class about 5 years ago if you went solar had to install at least 3 meters. 15 years ago liars said they were working on allowing application for meters but 10 years later still can not.
 

Jraef

Moderator
Staff member
Location
San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
Occupation
Electrical Engineer
I love how this story got so overblown and misquoted all around the country.

All that REALLY happened is that San Francisco and other municipalities have implemented a local Building Code rule saying that all new residential construction be required to have CIRCUIT CAPACITY for all electric appliances. There is no requirement to eliminate natural gas appliances nor is there a requirement to prevent the installation of the infrastructure for it (i.e. gas lines), which is what the extremists wanted. It just means you can't build a house with a 60A or 100A service any more. The stated CONCEPT behind this is to slowly move people away from natural gas because of the carbon footprint it entails, there is no "upcoming mandatory stoppage of all natural gas appliances in houses". But hyperbole reigns supreme in this country right now, so everyone with an agenda, one way or the other, is jumping all over this and exaggerating the concepts as if they are reality.

Personally, as the owner f a hose with mostly gas appliances, I welcome the change because when I go to cash in on my house in a few years, I will make bank having gas appliances. Right now, PG&E is charging 50 cents/kWh for peak usage over your baseline level*. That is only going to get WORSE in the coming years. People with all electric houses are in SHOCK as to how big their energy bills are, I have heard stories of $2-3k/month for some of these McMansions everyone is building. No think you...

*You didn't think the payouts for all the wildffire lawsuits was going to come out of their pockets, did you?
 
I love how this story got so overblown and misquoted all around the country.

All that REALLY happened is that San Francisco and other municipalities have implemented a local Building Code rule saying that all new residential construction be required to have CIRCUIT CAPACITY for all electric appliances. There is no requirement to eliminate natural gas appliances nor is there a requirement to prevent the installation of the infrastructure for it (i.e. gas lines), which is what the extremists wanted. It just means you can't build a house with a 60A or 100A service any more. The stated CONCEPT behind this is to slowly move people away from natural gas because of the carbon footprint it entails, there is no "upcoming mandatory stoppage of all natural gas appliances in houses". But hyperbole reigns supreme in this country right now, so everyone with an agenda, one way or the other, is jumping all over this and exaggerating the concepts as if they are reality.
Yup its just like all the BS that flew around about the green new deal. Not even saying I support it, but just the blatant falsehoods said about how it would ban meat/hamburgers, air travel, etc. Like, its literally 14 pages long and really vague and general. I just read the whole thing. The words "aircraft" and "meat" are not even in it. :ROFLMAO:
 

drcampbell

Senior Member
Location
The Motor City, Michigan USA
Occupation
Engineer
See for yourself:
 

Barbqranch

Senior Member
Location
Arcata, CA
Occupation
Plant maintenance electrician Semi-retired
Berkeley CA and a couple of other cities have indeed banned natural gas hook-ups in new construction, and a federal judge has upheld it.
 

AC\DC

Senior Member
Location
Florence,Oregon,Lane
Occupation
EC
Yup its just like all the BS that flew around about the green new deal. Not even saying I support it, but just the blatant falsehoods said about how it would ban meat/hamburgers, air travel, etc. Like, its literally 14 pages long and really vague and general. I just read the whole thing. The words "aircraft" and "meat" are not even in it. :ROFLMAO:
It’s not about banning the items you specify. It’s about making them so expensive that only the elites can afford.
the same people that scream about global warming as there house uses more electricity than your neighbor hood. Or using there private jets instead on flying like the average person. Practice what your preach!
 
It’s not about banning the items you specify. It’s about making them so expensive that only the elites can afford.
the same people that scream about global warming as there house uses more electricity than your neighbor hood. Or using there private jets instead on flying like the average person. Practice what your preach!
Read it. There were ZERO policy provisions in it. Plus it was all non binding.
 

AC\DC

Senior Member
Location
Florence,Oregon,Lane
Occupation
EC
I have, look up ESG score ,and think about how getting loan will work for your business with the green deal.
The way to hell is paved with good intentions.
 
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