Wiring in a new home

[don_resqcapt19]

Mind quoting me where I said anyone was "making up rules"? You or the other guy that said it, too. I'll wait.

You said:

Doesn't matter what the code says when the AHJ wants to see something.

That clearly indicates "making up rules" to me.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I remember there being a requirement for a 20A outside receptacle by the front “and optional rear door” as well.

I have a scar on my right middle finger which I believe I acquired making a hole in Hardy Board for one of those things.

Either that was a local amendment or you are a lot older than your picture indicates
There is no such requirement in the NEC for codes from 1975 through the 2020.

 

[Little Bill]

I remember there being a requirement for a 20A outside receptacle by the front “and optional rear door” as well.

I have a scar on my right middle finger which I believe I acquired making a hole in Hardy Board for one of those things.

There is no, and never has been, a requirement for a 20A receptacle or circuit outside. There is a requirement for dwellings that you have to have a receptacle at the front and back, (accessible from grade, w/exceptions), but doesn't have to be on a separate circuit and doesn't have to be 20A.

Unless there are a lot of outdoor receptacles wanted/needed. I just come off of an area that allows it, such as living room, bedroom, garage, etc.
Of course, it would have to be GFCI protected. With today's requirements for AFCI and GFCI, I usually just use DF breakers. So the outside receptacles would be covered for GFCI.

 

[tallgirl]

Either that was a local amendment or you are a lot older than your picture indicates
There is no such requirement in the NEC for codes from 1975 through the 2020.

I’ve never updated my photo on this website. I think that’s me when I was 38. I recently turned 60.

 

[tallgirl]

There is no, and never has been, a requirement for a 20A receptacle or circuit outside. There is a requirement for dwellings that you have to have a receptacle at the front and back, (accessible from grade, w/exceptions), but doesn't have to be on a separate circuit and doesn't have to be 20A.

Unless there are a lot of outdoor receptacles wanted/needed. I just come off of an area that allows it, such as living room, bedroom, garage, etc.
Of course, it would have to be GFCI protected. With today's requirements for AFCI and GFCI, I usually just use DF breakers. So the outside receptacles would be covered for GFCI.

THAT’S the one! They were also wired on a 20A GFCI back when the only other circuits that required GFCI were kitchen and bathrooms and you can’t use those for anything else.

I thought I was losing my mind. Glad you found it rolling around on the floor.

 

[LarryFine]

I’ve never updated my photo on this website. I think that’s me when I was 38. I recently turned 60.

I remember your pic from years ago when you lived in Texas. I'm sure you're still just as beautiful.

I joined a year before you did, and I'm 67. So you're still a youngster. You'll never catch up with me.

 

[tallgirl]

I remember your pic from years ago when you lived in Texas. I'm sure you're still just as beautiful.

I joined a year before you did, and I'm 67. So you're still a youngster. You'll never catch up with me.

Flattery will get you everywhere.

 

[Frank DuVal]

On a side note, I despise fixtures!

That's OK, I despise recessed lights.

 

[James L]

I agree 100%. Besides, (aside from your Greenlee PVC heater) when was the last time you saw a 20A plug on a kitchen appliance ?

I even have a 1920 watt hot pot that has only a 15 amp plug. It gets a bit warm, too

 

[James L]

I wire some new homes, and there's definitely a difference between code minimum and MY minimum.

I use lots of recessed lights. Every bedroom gets wired for ceiling fan. I install LED strip under cabinet lighting. I refuse to use a cheapo loud bath fan. I almost never load kitchen circuit to ore than 3 receptacles. I put a dedicated circuit forth service gfci near the AC unit. There are others, too

But I also know I can't work for most builders.
I'm told on every bid that my price is higher than the next guy. And when pennies matter, thousands of dollars worth of my preferences just won't sell

 

[Frank DuVal]

and the bathrooms get one light in the ceiling. No vanity lights.

Wow, what shadows! I would never buy one of those houses. Vanity light, no ceiling light much better for using the mirror. Millions and millions of houses built that way since houses were first electrified.

Nobody wants fans in the 1 million plus homes around here, looks ghetto and like you don't have A/C.

Must be a New York thing. I Rarely saw ceiling fans installed in houses without AC. If the house was old enough to not have AC, it had a "whole house attic fan" or window fan set to exhaust to pull air through every room. Porches had ceiling fans in houses without AC.

For the last 40 years every new house around here gets AC with some form of forced air heating. The only "new" house I saw in 40 years with hydronic heat was a from the sill up new house because of a fire and the original house had hydronic heat, so the insurance paid for another hydronic heat system. Owner paid for the AC ducted system.

 

[GeorgeB]

I even have a 1920 watt hot pot that has only a 15 amp plug. It gets a bit warm, too

I think the contact area is the same on 20A and 15A plugs/receptacles. Certainly the neutral sides are. I'd expect it is the #18 or #16 wire connections that are getting warm?

 

[AC\DC]

"Code Minimum" is like getting a D- on a test, you pass but it is nothing to brag about.

I would say code minimum is a skill. You have to know the code to just pass of bare minimum. It’s easy to just through a bunch of crap in and one of those will meet a requirement.
Did not relive its already three pages lol, probably on another subject already

 

[farmantenna]

"Code Minimum" is like getting a D- on a test, you pass but it is nothing to brag about.

you wire a house based on what your paying customer wants.

 

[farmantenna]

I would be livid if I paid half a million dollars for a house and got a cheap-n-dirty electric system. I would demand the wiring be done a certain way. Of course, since I'm an electrician, I would wire the house myself rather than their contractor, but I guess I'm speaking on behalf of the majority who don't have such skills.

But I always thought that the Code required outdoor outlets to be on a separate circuit from the GP lighting circuits.

no

 

[James L]

you wire a house based on what your paying customer wants.

Well, not exactly.

Paying customers will sometimes say they need only 1 receptacle in a particular room, they don't need a receptacle at all in a half bath, etc

 

[gene6]

There was a legendary home around here (supply house talk) started out as a home builder package for a nice businessman moving to retire, he had owned a firm in Chicago, something to do with metal so he really liked metal. When he found out his home would be wired with Romex he blew his top, then he got the change order for EMT blew top again.
Legend has it this homeowner owner flew out two J-man from Chicago (his previous EC for his company) whom roughed the place in EMT working under the local EC then flew them back. Apparently they took the same manhours to do the house as the local guys would have with NM. There was a photo in our supply house of the home roughed in EMT for years but its gone now.
EMT Not flex not MC -- EMT.
This would have been in the late 80's, I don't know if all new Chicago residences are EMT anymore.

 

[brantmacga]

Apparently they took the same manhours to do the house as the local guys would have with NM.

I'm certain that guys wiring that way every single day would be faster than even us that run pipe in commercial buildings. Hard to believe they did it in the same time as a house roper.

I live in an area with many of large generational estate homes, and most of them are piped.

 

[g-and-h_electric]

Gene, and all:

Yes Chicago , Cook county, and most of the surrounding counties are "pipe and wire". Having seen the "quality" of some drywall guys, I wouldnt wire a building any other way, not to mention the ease in changing wiring after the walls go up.


Howard

 

[James L]

Gene, and all:

Yes Chicago , Cook county, and most of the surrounding counties are "pipe and wire". Having seen the "quality" of some drywall guys, I wouldnt wire a building any other way, not to mention the ease in changing wiring after the walls go up.


Howard

How do you add wiring in a remodel situation where the walls and ceilings aren't disturbed?