JohnE
Senior Member
- Location
- Milford, MA
georgestolz said:
Yeah, but how much do those little plastic tamper proof inserts cost? As others have made the point, a code change will be no substitute for good parenting.
child proof recepts being required!?
- Thread starter poopypants
- Start date
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Yeah, but how much do those little plastic tamper proof inserts cost? As others have made the point, a code change will be no substitute for good parenting.
post #158
If the CMPs keep believing everything the manufacturer lobbyists tell them, the whole code changing process is going to resemble politics more and more. . Anybody that's read the CMP members comments in the 2008ROP AFCI section can see how dependent some CMP members already are on lobbyists.
post #156
Do the majority of CMP members realize that when sitting thru the lobbyists presentations ?
David
macmikeman said:
If the CMPs keep believing everything the manufacturer lobbyists tell them, the whole code changing process is going to resemble politics more and more. . Anybody that's read the CMP members comments in the 2008ROP AFCI section can see how dependent some CMP members already are on lobbyists.
post #156
iwire said:
Do the majority of CMP members realize that when sitting thru the lobbyists presentations ?
David
brother
Senior Member
I was not aware of this thread at first before i started my own about the tamper resistant recepticles. Yes the 'principal' of parenting need to stay with the parents. God help the thinking of the CMP!!
cschmid
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern cold country
hey its all about the cash who has it and who wants it..we dont need parents we have big brother..
iaov
Senior Member
- Location
- Rhinelander WI
Amen brother!!cschmid said:
iaov
Senior Member
- Location
- Rhinelander WI
Sparkey I wanted to write what you did but I was too lazy. I'm 51 and grew up in that marvelous,dangerous time. You said it all.Thanx!!480sparky said:PEOPLE OVER FORTY SHOULD BE DEAD
According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids in the 40's, 50's, 60's, or even maybe the early 70's probably shouldn't have survived.
Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint. We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, doors or cabinets, ... and when we rode our bikes, we had no helmets. (Not to mention the risks we took hitchhiking.) As children, we would ride in cars with no crumple zones, seatbelts or air bags.
Riding in the back of a pickup truck on a warm day was always a special treat. We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle. Horrors! We ate cupcakes, bread with real butter, and drank sugar-ladened soda pop, but we were never overweight because we were always outside playing. We shared one soft drink with four friends, from one bottle, and no one actually died from this.
We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then rode down the hill, only to find out we forgot about brakes. After running into the bushes a few times, we learned to solve the problem. We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as we were back when the street lights came on. No one was able to reach us all day.
NO CELL PHONES!!!!! Unthinkable!
We did not have Playstations, Nintendo 64, X-Boxes, no video games at all, no 299 channels on cable and satellite, video tape movies, DVD players, surround sound, personal cell phones, personal computers, text messaging or Internet chat rooms! . We had friends! We went outside and found them. We played dodge ball, and sometimes, the ball would really hurt. We fell out of trees, got cut and broke bones and teeth, and there were no lawsuits from these accidents. They were accidents. No one was to blame but us. Remember accidents?
We had fights and punched each other and got black and blue and learned to get over it. We made up games with sticks and tennis balls and ate worms, and although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very many eyes, nor did the worms live inside us forever. We rode bikes or walked to a friend's home and knocked on the door, or rang the bell or just walked in and talked to them.
Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team.Those who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment. Some students weren't as smart as others, so they failed a grade and were held back to repeat the same grade. Horrors! Tests were not adjusted for any reason.
Our actions were our own. Consequences were expected. The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke a law was unheard of. They actually sided with the law. Imagine that!
This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers and problem solvers and inventors, ever. The past 50 years have been an explosion of innovation and new ideas. We had freedom, failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal with it all.
How fortunate we were to grow up as kids before lawyers and burgeoning government regulated our lives, for our own good. How sorry I am for what those years of meddling have done to our children and grandchildren and even sorrier that we all allowed the government and politicians to get away with it!
........................
iaov
Senior Member
- Location
- Rhinelander WI
One thing that has not changed in my thirty years in the field is that as more things are being made "idot proof" the more they keep making better idiots!!:smile:cschmid said:
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- Location
- Massachusetts
iaov said:
The fact that many of us 'made it' does not change the fact that many have not and they are not here to ask for some changes.
I was using a table saw at a young age, will I let my young kids use one...no way.
My view has been changing on this new code section. When I first learned of it I thought it was nuts.
However the more I have thought about it why shouldn't the NEC try to make things safer?
Sadly it is probably true that some of the motivation for this is the sales it will generate...oh well.....money makes the world go round...no surprise there.
As far as this 'big brother issue' thats simply not true, the Govt does not write the NEC.
iaov
Senior Member
- Location
- Rhinelander WI
Big brother doesn't always come dressed in Red White & Blue. Sometimes he wears a hat that says AHJ!iwire said:
- Location
- Massachusetts
iaov said:
Your point being?
The AHJ only enforces the rules that we let get adopted.
That is like blaming the police for enforcing the law.
There are public comment periods for each new NEC.
It will be interesting to see how many areas accept this section as written or amend it out.
iaov
Senior Member
- Location
- Rhinelander WI
My point being that this certainly is a "big brother " issue. Any time we have an authority enforcing something , wether good or not, its a big brother issue. Let us not forget that democracy is often nothing more than tyranny by the majority. People forget that the ballot box brought Hitler and the Nazis into power.iwire said:
cschmid
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern cold country
iwire said:
I agree it is not the AHJ that is big bother but the NEC..Yes there are public comment periods but they are not very well publicized and unless you are right on top of the code you can miss it and even might not know about it until it is to late..This can give us a feeling of helplessness and that bothers allot of people..Yet there are those who do not care and this encourages the insurance companies and such to drive these issues..so I am old school with new techno ideas and still do not like big brother or should I call it the machine and as time goes by the machine grows and grows..
donselectric
Senior Member
- Location
- nh
code is big business.....device manu's will make billions
and thats just one change...
and thats just one change...
stickboy1375
Senior Member
- Location
- Litchfield, CT
Boy, out of all the child safety things that actually need improvement, receptacles should be on the bottom of the list... my opinion of course, to make this a code requirement is absolutely BS, and just another example of some company with money making more money....end of story,
If you feel the need to extra protect your kids do so, but don't enforce it on everyone... I have no problem watching my kids.
If you feel the need to extra protect your kids do so, but don't enforce it on everyone... I have no problem watching my kids.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
stickboy1375 said:
Is this one one of yours. Caught him with a screwdriver in the receptacle.
stickboy1375
Senior Member
- Location
- Litchfield, CT
Nope, this one is though...
Those child safety caps IMO are a real PITA to remove by the way....
Those child safety caps IMO are a real PITA to remove by the way....
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cschmid
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern cold country
I love to play devils advocate but this requirement is only for residential correct?? well my wife works for social services and one of the clients let their kid play with the car keys and he stuck them in an outlet. my wife said it made a sound that i am unable to describe with words and smoked the wall; but no one hurt and was able to use car key..so what about commercial setting where kids are still unsupervised...
brother
Senior Member
cschmid said:
Shhhh, be quiet!! they might hear you!!
- Location
- Massachusetts
brother said:
:wink:
Tamper resistant receptacles have already been required for quite some time in pediatric care areas. 517.18(C)
- Location
- Massachusetts
stickboy1375 said:
True, but the NEC only addresses electrical issues. :wink:
If you think accidents only happen to parents that don't watch their kids you are definitely mistaken.
Why is this new requirement any different then the NEC requiring cover plates on plugs and switches?
They serve no electrical function they are only there to protect us from shocks and contain sparks.
There was a time when all electrical distribution equipment was live front. I bet when those rules changed people also complained this is BS. :smile:
Should we go back to live front gear or did that rule turn out to make sense?
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