Home inspections

[pfalcon]

I have not applied an answer here..I keep asking where the gray line is?

I keep answering. An HI should be inspecting everything a knowledgeable HO can inspect.

I see no difference in a person (who ever) that is not an electrician that comes in and performs an electrical test with a meter and says that the voltage drop is wrong and you need to have this circuit split in half and made 2 circuits and a HVAC installing a circuit for his new AC unit.

The use of a meter does not electrical work make. I find that a very arrogant statement that says you're stupid if you don't have a piece of paper. Where that meter gets used and how determines whether the HI has crossed the line. If he's checking outlets with the plug-in then he's fine. If he's pulling off the panel front then he isn't fine. I'll fire him. As to recommending that a circuit be split that isn't his call. I'll fire him again. But he better recommend I up the stakes because the wiring is an issue.

They are both electrical work done by unlicensed individuals. The law reads if you accept cash for electrical work you must be a licensed electrician. that is paraphrased.

Define work. Your apparent definition is like the Zero-Tolerance (read Zero-Judgement) policies. I reject that definition. My HIs have never done electrical work. They have done cursory superficial eyeballing and basic "I expect this of an HO" type testing.

This I disagree with it is not compared to other homes. The HI is biased and does not work for the home owner he works for the seller and once this report is generated it is on file at real estate office. So if it is negative and it normally is so buyer can negotiate with seller a seller loss. This taints opinions of all the agents associated with the real estate property.

Anyone that accepts an HI report purchased by the seller or his listing agent deserves what he gets. I never have. The HI works for me the buyer and I'll be the one to hire him. And of course it's negative - he's looking for problems. And yes it normally drops the price. But why do you call this a seller loss? If the roof is leaking do you really believe the buyer should pay like it doesn't? Keep your place in good shape and there won't be any major findings.

No we get to the problem how many people do we need taking a cut in the property? You believe an agent is worth 7% of a 150,000 dollar house = 10,500 dollars plus the loss of income due to a HI report. Now ask your self how do we afford a used home? When do we call enough enough. how many more hands in the pot.

You keep talking like the HI belongs to the seller. ABSOLUTELY NOT. Except as required by law I will never hire an HI as a seller. When I've bought and the listing agent tried to give me an HI report then I knew a con was in the making. The HI belongs to me the buyer; not me the seller. Me the buyer pays for the HI.

So if your house is worth an appraised value how much more do you think it is worth? Where do you draw the line? I believe we should start with what the law says if you do electrical work you need a license that is why the rule makers phrased it that way.

Again, I find your definition of work to be a very self-serving, greedy definition. I do not agree that the HI is doing electrical work. You keep asking these questions as though it was agreed that he does do electrical work.

so my question is where do we draw the line what is electrical work? Is testing electrical circuits and recommending a plan of action electrical work? and why? Is removing lights and reinstalling them electrical work? And why? Is relocating them electrical work? and why? is installing a circuit for an HVAC unit electrical work? and why?

Spamming questions like this blurs the issues. Within it presumes that someone who inspects also recommends a solution. This is a false presumption. My HIs recommend when I should escalate to a tradesman.

I want us to think about this seriously as industries grow and develop it seems like they keep giving loop holes and regulating our industry more. Why?

People cry for government regulation because they feel they personally have no control. But handing control to someone that has no stake in the process only makes matters worse. Insurance companies and lenders have a stake in home inspections - not the government. A large part of the NEC was insurance driven - not government driven. We should continue with examples like the NEC - not beg for government regulations.

 

[cschmid]

Bob oops I meant buyer not seller give me few minutes as site has change and I will have to look it up..

 

[cschmid]

I keep answering. An HI should be inspecting everything a knowledgeable HO can inspect.


The use of a meter does not electrical work make. I find that a very arrogant statement that says you're stupid if you don't have a piece of paper. Where that meter gets used and how determines whether the HI has crossed the line. If he's checking outlets with the plug-in then he's fine. If he's pulling off the panel front then he isn't fine. I'll fire him. As to recommending that a circuit be split that isn't his call. I'll fire him again. But he better recommend I up the stakes because the wiring is an issue.

I can agree with part of this statement because some of the HI's use their findings to make recommendations and that is when i feel the line is crossed. So why do they need the meters if they are not going to make some kind of assessment? I also apologize for the miss use of buyer and seller in this conversation.


Define work. Your apparent definition is like the Zero-Tolerance (read Zero-Judgement) policies. I reject that definition. My HIs have never done electrical work. They have done cursory superficial eyeballing and basic "I expect this of an HO" type testing.

Nope not zero tolerance just want to see where we as electricians are willing to draw the line with other trades doing electrical work?

Anyone that accepts an HI report purchased by the seller or his listing agent deserves what he gets. I never have. The HI works for me the buyer and I'll be the one to hire him. And of course it's negative - he's looking for problems. And yes it normally drops the price. But why do you call this a seller loss? If the roof is leaking do you really believe the buyer should pay like it doesn't? Keep your place in good shape and there won't be any major findings.

Again I missed used seller when I meant buyer

You keep talking like the HI belongs to the seller. ABSOLUTELY NOT. Except as required by law I will never hire an HI as a seller. When I've bought and the listing agent tried to give me an HI report then I knew a con was in the making. The HI belongs to me the buyer; not me the seller. Me the buyer pays for the HI.



Again, I find your definition of work to be a very self-serving, greedy definition. I do not agree that the HI is doing electrical work. You keep asking these questions as though it was agreed that he does do electrical work.

So you are saying it is okay to do electrical work with out a license as long as you do not remove the cover of an electrical panel

Spamming questions like this blurs the issues. Within it presumes that someone who inspects also recommends a solution. This is a false presumption. My HIs recommend when I should escalate to a tradesman.

That is what is suppose to happen, yet not always the case and there is no consequences and no liability when they cross the line or atleast none that I am aware of.

People cry for government regulation because they feel they personally have no control. But handing control to someone that has no stake in the process only makes matters worse. Insurance companies and lenders have a stake in home inspections - not the government. A large part of the NEC was insurance driven - not government driven. We should continue with examples like the NEC - not beg for government regulations.

Trust me I do not cry for governmental regulation. I also take concern when we allow the minority to rule the majority. insurance companies use the term of death to influence decision making processes. Death is not something we can escape and to die is the easy way out. to be left behind with years worth of medical issues and permanent disabilities is what sucks. so why does death out weigh years worth of suffering? now this is way off topic but yet in a way on topic. I also believe if this turns into a legalized discussion then we have miss the topic as we here will do nothing to affect the law. only hope is to increase the conversations on areas that need to be addressed before other industries address them for us as in regulations. I do not know how to do more then suggest the ideas as I have no political influence in these areas.

I really want to thank you for sticking around as I want to know what others classify as okay for unlicensed people to do in the electrical field.

 

[cschmid]

Bob Here is what you ask for this is the first one I came accross and the link is so you can read the whole thing.

326B.33 LICENSES.
Subdivision 1. Master electrician. Except as otherwise provided by law, no individual shall perform or
supervise electrical work unless the individual is: (a) licensed by the commissioner as a master
electrician; and (b)(i) the electrical work is for a licensed contractor and the individual is an employee,
partner, or officer of, or is the licensed contractor, or (ii) the electrical work is performed for the
individual's employer on electrical wiring, apparatus, equipment, or facilities that are owned or leased by
the employer and that are located within the limits of property operated, maintained, and either owned or
leased by the employer

Subd. 14. Contractor's license required. Except as otherwise provided by law, no individual other than an
employee, partner, or officer of a licensed contractor, as defined by section 326B.31, subdivision 14,
shall perform or offer to perform electrical work with or without compensation unless the individual
obtains a contractor's license. A contractor's license does not of itself qualify its holder to perform or
supervise the electrical work authorized by holding any class of personal license.


this is the link to the rules in MN

http://www.dli.mn.gov/ccld/PDF/eli_laws_and_rules.pdf

So am I being arrogant or are these statements treated more like guide lines instead of rules which I agreed to when I became a master electrician.

 

[cschmid]

here is another part of the regulations and that these are part of the exceptions in our license in mn. I still do not know why I am told I have zero tolerance. Am I reading this wrong.

Subd. 21. Exemptions from licensing.
(d) Heating, ventilating, air conditioning, and refrigeration contractors and their employees are not
required to hold or obtain a license under sections 326B.31 to 326B.399 when performing heating,
ventilating, air conditioning, or refrigeration work as described in section 326B.38.

326B.38 MANUFACTURED ELECTRICAL PARTS; EXEMPTION.
Subdivision 1. Manufacturers. Electrical components, apparatus, or appliances being manufactured
within the limits of property which is owned or leased by a manufacturer and such manufacturer's
production employees are not covered by sections 326B.31 to 326B.399.
Subd. 2. Electrical appliance units. Installation, alteration, or repair of electrical appliance units are not
covered by sections 326B.31 to 326B.399. For the purposes of this section, "electrical appliance units"
means all electrical and fossil fuel appliances that use electricity including, but not limited to, furnaces,
water heaters, stoves, clothes washers, dryers, and dishwashers. The installation of electrical wiring to
an electrical appliance unit is covered by sections 326B.31 to 326B.399.
Subd. 3. Other units. Planning, laying out, and installation of heating, ventilating, air conditioning, or
refrigeration units are not covered by sections 326B.31 to 326B.399. For purposes of this section,
heating, ventilating, air conditioning, or refrigeration units include, but are not limited to, air conditioning
units, air conditioning evaporators, air conditioning condensers, air conditioning and refrigeration chillers,
boilers, furnaces, air handling units, rooftop units, humidifiers, ice makers, and supermarket, ice arena,
and bar/restaurant equipment. The installation of electrical wiring to the unit is covered by sections
326B.31 to 326B.399.
26
Subd. 4. Other equipment. Planning, laying out, alteration, replacement, or repair of heating, ventilating,
air conditioning, or refrigeration equipment, and associated devices, controls, and wiring including wiring
in or on the equipment, are not covered by sections 326B.31 to 326B.399 when the work is performed by
an employee of a heating, ventilating, air conditioning, or refrigeration contractor provided that the
employee performing the work has received a certificate of completion from a heating, ventilating, air
conditioning, or refrigeration apprenticeship program approved by the state of Minnesota or any class of
personal license issued by the commissioner. Employees registered in an approved heating, ventilating,
air conditioning, or refrigeration program may design, plan, alter, replace, or repair heating, ventilating,
air conditioning, or refrigeration equipment, devices, and controls including wiring in or on the equipment,
under the direction of an employee who has a certificate of completion from an approved program or any
class of personal license issued by the commissioner. The installation of electrical wiring to the unit is
covered by sections 326B.31 to 326B.399.

326B.31 DEFINITIONS
Subd. 17. Electrical work. "Electrical work" means the installing, altering, repairing, planning, or laying out
of electrical wiring, apparatus, or equipment for electrical light, heat, power, technology circuits or
systems, or other purposes. The installing, altering, repairing, planning, or laying out of electrical wiring,
apparatus, or equipment for electrical light, heat, power, technology circuits or systems, or other
purposes includes, but is not limited to, the performance of any work regulated by the standards referred
to in section 326B.35.
326B.35 SAFETY STANDARDS.
326B.399 Citation

 

[ty]

Here is my stance: (which has remained the same for many years on this and other forums)

Electrical Work should be Inspected by LICENSED Electrical Inspectors.

I don't see that a HI is doing Electrical work by taking some meter readings (or the other things mentioned above), but he is Inspecting Electrical work or the Electrical System.
IMO, unless licensed by the State, the HI is not Qualified to do this Inspection.
Just as someone doing electrical work must show his qualifications by being licensed throught the State.
(this applies to my state and might not apply to yours if there is not statewide licensing)

 

[pfalcon]

326B.31 DEFINITIONS
Subd. 17. Electrical work. "Electrical work" means the installing, altering, repairing, planning, or laying out
of electrical wiring, apparatus, or equipment for electrical light, heat, power, technology circuits or
systems, or other purposes. The installing, altering, repairing, planning, or laying out of electrical wiring,
apparatus, or equipment for electrical light, heat, power, technology circuits or systems, or other
purposes includes, but is not limited to, the performance of any work regulated by the standards referred
to in section 326B.35.

By this definition none of my Home Inspectors have ever done electrical work.

Here is my stance: (which has remained the same for many years on this and other forums)

Electrical Work should be Inspected by LICENSED Electrical Inspectors.

I don't see that a HI is doing Electrical work by taking some meter readings (or the other things mentioned above), but he is Inspecting Electrical work or the Electrical System.
IMO, unless licensed by the State, the HI is not Qualified to do this Inspection.
Just as someone doing electrical work must show his qualifications by being licensed throught the State.
(this applies to my state and might not apply to yours if there is not statewide licensing)

Are you licensed to inspect cars? Don't you check your own oil level and tire pressures? Don't you refill your washer fluid? How about topping off your engine coolant?

Just so. The HI is not doing the type of electrical inspection that you imply by requiring a license. The HI is doing the inspections an HO is expected to do for himself - also without a license. The HI is doing all the HO inspections that the typical HO might forget about. He does it quickly and efficiently to minimize the interruption to the HO. Remember, the HI is working for a buyer or a lender - not the HO.

 

[ty]

By this definition none of my Home Inspectors have ever done electrical work.



Are you licensed to inspect cars? Don't you check your own oil level and tire pressures? Don't you refill your washer fluid? How about topping off your engine coolant?

Just so. The HI is not doing the type of electrical inspection that you imply by requiring a license. The HI is doing the inspections an HO is expected to do for himself - also without a license. The HI is doing all the HO inspections that the typical HO might forget about. He does it quickly and efficiently to minimize the interruption to the HO. Remember, the HI is working for a buyer or a lender - not the HO.

I don't inspect cars.
I will inspect MY OWN oil level, etc. But I would Not inspect a vehicle for someone that is going to purchase a vehicle. (say I did, and the brakes failed on their way home, they crash and someone is seriously injured or killed....real smart.)

In MY STATE, (which I stated), it is REQUIRED by LAW that you must be a Licensed Electrical Inspector to perform Electrical Inspections.

(IN my State), a HI's opinion is not worth the piece of paper that it is written on, in regards to inspecting the Electrical system, and would not hold up in any court of Law.
Maybe your state has different laws, I don't know.

EDIT:
and, I was trying to point out that I agree with you that your HI's are not doing Electrical Work. But, IMO, they are performing Electrical Inspections.

 

[pfalcon]

I don't inspect cars.
I will inspect MY OWN oil level, etc. But I would Not inspect a vehicle for someone that is going to purchase a vehicle. (say I did, and the brakes failed on their way home, they crash and someone is seriously injured or killed....real smart.)

In MY STATE, (which I stated), it is REQUIRED by LAW that you must be a Licensed Electrical Inspector to perform Electrical Inspections.

(IN my State), a HI's opinion is not worth the piece of paper that it is written on, in regards to inspecting the Electrical system, and would not hold up in any court of Law.
Maybe your state has different laws, I don't know.

EDIT:
and, I was trying to point out that I agree with you that your HI's are not doing Electrical Work. But, IMO, they are performing Electrical Inspections.

I understand we agree about electrical work. I was replying because I do not agree about electrical inspection.

I had a much longer reply started but I'm going to boil it down to this: When did you last buy a house? What inspections did you pay for after making a bid and before settling on a final price? This is when the HI does his inspections.

 

[charlietuna]

I just don't know how we got along before there were "HOME INSPECTORS" ? I have followed behind them enough to know they create too many false problems. That to me is their biggest issue. Secondly, i think they can leave a homeowner with a false sense of security concerning their home's electrical system. They are used as a "TOOL" to lower the selling price of a house, and then those deficiencies are never actually corrected. Most of the time they inspect those items they were taught in class or read in a book. They could trip over a disconnected main ground wire and not even know what it is. There was a story posted here about one HI who reported an older home needed to be re-wired due to aluminum wire. Cost the homeowner $5K ! And many who label certain equipment manufacturers as "illegal" ? There are "GOOD AND BAD" in any industry, but the HI trade is to me a 50/50 deal. They have too much power and not enough background knowledge, and need to be standardized in testing and required training.

 

[cschmid]

I don't inspect cars.
I will inspect MY OWN oil level, etc. But I would Not inspect a vehicle for someone that is going to purchase a vehicle. (say I did, and the brakes failed on their way home, they crash and someone is seriously injured or killed....real smart.)

In MY STATE, (which I stated), it is REQUIRED by LAW that you must be a Licensed Electrical Inspector to perform Electrical Inspections.

(IN my State), a HI's opinion is not worth the piece of paper that it is written on, in regards to inspecting the Electrical system, and would not hold up in any court of Law.
Maybe your state has different laws, I don't know.

EDIT:
and, I was trying to point out that I agree with you that your HI's are not doing Electrical Work. But, IMO, they are performing Electrical Inspections.

That is the same in MN as well. I guess my opinion here is that we continually allow others in different trades to keep inching there way into our profession.

Their argument is that we have been doing this type of work for years and they get a law passed to allow it. So where do we draw the line?

 

[cschmid]

I just don't know how we got along before there were "HOME INSPECTORS" ? I have followed behind them enough to know they create too many false problems. That to me is their biggest issue. Secondly, i think they can leave a homeowner with a false sense of security concerning their home's electrical system. They are used as a "TOOL" to lower the selling price of a house, and then those deficiencies are never actually corrected. Most of the time they inspect those items they were taught in class or read in a book. They could trip over a disconnected main ground wire and not even know what it is. There was a story posted here about one HI who reported an older home needed to be re-wired due to aluminum wire. Cost the homeowner $5K ! And many who label certain equipment manufacturers as "illegal" ? There are "GOOD AND BAD" in any industry, but the HI trade is to me a 50/50 deal. They have too much power and not enough background knowledge, and need to be standardized in testing and required training.

Some good point here but a lot of people support these inspections and they are for the sole purpose of lowering the sellers price. Which in return has driven the costs of homes up. I know I will not pay more then an appraised vale and if the appraised value and the tax base are several thousand apart I will have an independent appraisal done If I am interested.

 

[Cold Fusion]

CS -
I carefully read your two posts, 84 and 85, concerning the state law where you live. I didn't see anything in there that said a report on an electrical system is "electrical work" as defined by your state law.

Nor did I see anything that said removing an electrical panel cover for an inspection was "electrical work".

I don't see anything in your posts that would make HI work illegal

You keep saying "we" need to stop this (HIs doing inspections). I don't see how "we" as electricals can do anything about it. However, "you", as a citizen/resident of MN can. You want it different, then get your follow MN citizens to lobby to change the law.

cf

 

[cschmid]

CS -
I carefully read your two posts, 84 and 85, concerning the state law where you live. I didn't see anything in there that said a report on an electrical system is "electrical work" as defined by your state law.

Nor did I see anything that said removing an electrical panel cover for an inspection was "electrical work".

I don't see anything in your posts that would make HI work illegal

You keep saying "we" need to stop this (HIs doing inspections). I don't see how "we" as electricals can do anything about it. However, "you", as a citizen/resident of MN can. You want it different, then get your follow MN citizens to lobby to change the law.

cf

That is why I am asking where do we as electricians draw the line? there is a regulation that does clarify what minor electrical work is. But is removing a panel face considered electrical work? Some here say it is. So where do we draw the line.

I believe if you generate a report on electrical equipment and condition and receive cash for doing so you have engaged in the electrical business and then you need to be licensed. For instance if you make a determination that a federal pacific panel needs to be replaced and tell the buyer that in a report you have now accepted cash for electrical work and you need to be licensed. I do not believe that is minor electrical work like changing an outlet. In order to render an assessment on a piece of electrical equipment you must of did some sort of advanced testing. To render a verdict on a piece of equipment solely by name is slander and that makes you liable.

So if you think I am picking on HI's you are wrong I have also used other trades as illustrations. I used HI's to start this discussion because they are my pet peeve. Unless I can draw a line in the sand it really leaves a lot of gray area. If a HI can give you an assessment then why not the handy manny of the block do the same for cash. Why cant handy manny receive cash for changing your outlets out and switches out when he repaints your house. Yet it is okay for the sheet rock guy to rearrange the lights in your living room when he redoes your ceiling.

So where is the line and why do you feel that way? Also is there an ethical portion of our trade and what is your position on what is ethical?

I am doing research here amongst the professionals in our trade.

 

[Cold Fusion]

I appoligize for not being clear. my responses are in red.

That is why I am asking where do we as electricians draw the line? ...
As an electrician you can draw the line any where you want - it doesn't matter a bit. Your state law is what matters - and it says what the HIs are doing is okay.

... But is removing a panel face considered electrical work? ....
I didn't see anything in your state law that said removing a panel face is considered electrical work. Your agreeing or not doesn't matter. It is what your state court says that matters. I'm guessing your state courts are saying the HIs are doing just fine.

...I believe if you generate a report on electrical equipment and condition and receive cash for doing so you have engaged in the electrical business and then you need to be licensed. ...
Again - what you believe just doesn't matter. It is what your state law says - and the courts uphold.

So if you think I am picking on HI's you are wrong ...
Good you said that. I couldn't tell that from your posts.

Why cant handy manny receive cash for changing your outlets out and switches out when he repaints your house.
Because, as as your state law reads, posts 84 and 85, a COF is required for repairs.

Interestingly, in my state han-man can change the outlets and switches. The state law here differentiates between new installations, alterations and maintenance. A COF is not required for maintenance.

So where is the line and why do you feel that way?
I feel the line in your state is exactly where it should be, as your law makers, the ones you voted in, say it should be.

I think the line in my state is exactly where it should be, as the lawmakers here, the ones we voted in, say it should be.

cf

 

[rsole]

I know I'm going to get beat up here but I have to respond to some of the comments. First of all, I am one of those hated Home Inspectors.

Just to put things in perspective, I have been in residential construction for over 25 years. In that time I have built around 700 homes and I am a Florida Licensed Residential Contractor. I am an ICC certified Residential and Commercial Building Inspector. I am a Certified Master Inspector, I am mold certified and Infrared certified. As to training, I have had nearly 200 hours of classes related to home inspections alone not counting what I have had related to construction.

It has been a big issue in this thread that electrical work has to be done by a licensed electrical contractor. I agree, but it would take much too long to tell you all the shoddy (and sometimes unsafe) work I have seen that was done by those licensed electrical contractors. The point being that there are bad electricians just as there are bad home inspectors. I won't support the bad inspectors either. The problem is that the home buyers spend time shopping for the cheapest inspector they can find. I have lost many inspections because another inspector was $25 less than me. The cheapest inspector is often the least experienced.

If they are doing that now, what would happen if they had to hire an electrician? They would shop around and end up with the least experienced electrician to do the inspection. Worse yet, if they had to hire a licensed electrician, a licensed plumber, licensed HVAC contractor, a structural engineer, etc., they would not have the home inspected at all. Now who would win? It certainly wouldn't be the home buyer.

As has been mentioned, I am a generalist. I do not claim to be an electrician, and engineer, HVAC technician, etc. I do however know enough about all of them to catch most of the things that are going to cause the home buyer problems. That is what I am being paid to do. I know when the electrical work has not been performed in a professional manner and when I see that, I recommend that a professional be called in to do further evaluation. That is where you make your money. Trust me, if I had not made the home inspection, you would not even be in the picture.

I do not make any claim that I am going to find every possible problem, when you come in, you will most likely find something I didn't. That is your specialty. I would be disappointed if you didn't find something else.

It has been said here that if I make a bad call, the home owner has to pay for it and I have no liability. For the record, I had one homeowner call me that I called out a problem on a panel and the electrician said it was not a problem. He charged her $50.00, I refunded the entire inspection fee! As to not having liability, if that were true, I wouldn't be paying for $1,000,000 worth of insurance.

It was mentioned that there was a problem with the inspector saying that an FPE panel needed to be replaced. If he said that, he was wrong. A good home inspector will only say that something needs to be replaced if it is broken and falling off the wall. When I see an FPE (or Zinsco ) panel, I call it out as a problem. I provide the customer with information about them and recommend that they at least get it inspected further by a qualified electrician. If I didn't, they would likely be very upset when they tried to get insurance and found that the insurance company would not provide coverage until the panel was replaced.

Inspecting the electrical system as part of a home inspections is not "electrical work" any more than hooking that furnace up to the existing wiring. It is evaluating that part of the home for potential problems. (And yes I do remove the dead front. You might be surprised at the number of problems I discover when I do. Besides it is required by the SOP of nearly all inspections organizations.)

The fact is that most home buyers would not have the home inspected if they had to hire individual trades to inspect the home and would in many cases find out too late that they have to spend a lot of money to repair defects that they didn't know were there. Or worse yet, have someone injured or killed due to problems that could have been detected.

 

[roger]

Rsole, don't worry about getting beat up, that was a very post.

Roger

 

[cschmid]

Rsole nicely put..

cf You are clear with your stand..but others are on the fence..

Lmao this is still an interesting conversation.

lets be clear I have no issue with HVAC guys hooking up to existing wiring as long as they have their work inspected. I also have no issue with sheet rock guys removing lights to re do sheet rock as long as they do not reposition them. I also do not care about handy manny replacing outlets either to match the room..

I am still wondering where we draw the line and what is ethical in our trade?

Rsole so how much does an average house inspection cost? What liabilities do you have with an HI inspection? Rsole you are also not the norm in the HI business or at least not around here..

How much do you think home inspectors have driven the price of housing up? Do you think you add extra to the house just to cover the hassle? what about the foreclosure market do you think HI's are beneficial there?

I have lots of questions and my opinion has not been changed yet.

 

[LarryFine]

Rsole, don't worry about getting beat up, that was a very post.

Yes, it was very.

 

[roger]

Yes, it was very.

For some unknown reason my PC does not accept words that contain more than one "o" before 6:00 AM.

Roger