Is this allowed?

[jxofaltrds]

I am looking at this picture and have never seen this performed.

Note the multi wire feed + an addition circuit.

Doesn't look right but I can think of a violation.

I do not know if the additional 'black' is from a three wire or not.

This is a internet posted pic.

 

[LEO2854]

I am looking at this picture and have never seen this performed.

Note the multi wire feed + an addition circuit.

Doesn't look right but I can think of a violation.

I do not know if the additional 'black' is from a three wire or not.

This is a internet posted pic.

View attachment 9549

It depends on whether or not the breaker terminal is rated for two conductors,otherwise it's a violation of 110.3.

 

[GoldDigger]

I am looking at this picture and have never seen this performed.

Note the multi wire feed + an addition circuit.

Doesn't look right but I can think of a violation.

I do not know if the additional 'black' is from a three wire or not.

The handle tie (functional?) indicates to me that the two breakers feed an MWBC. If the same neutral feeds all three of the wires, and the two black wires together are treated as part of the same MWBC, just going in two different directions, then there may not be a violation there. You can separate an MWBC into to (or more) separate circuits downstream just by branching the neutral. Under current code there may be an issue with the wires of the MWBC being grouped for identification within the panel.

 

[david]

since the breaker is labeled kitchen/ dishwasher & refrigerator, I am wondering if this is kitchen receptacles or kitchen lights. If the breaker marked kitchen/dishwasher is in fact kitchen receptacles / dishwasher than this is a small appliance circuit and the dishwasher cannot be on the same breaker with the kitchen receptacles.

 

[macmikeman]

Outside of what David said and rightfully so, those square d breakers are listed for two conductors. However as stated d.w. cannot be on same breaker as kitchen small appliance receptacle outlet circuit. (two wires hooked together under the same SQ-D breaker is only one circuit)

 

[templdl]

Outside of what David said and rightfully so, those square d breakers are listed for two conductors. However as stated d.w. cannot be on same breaker as kitchen small appliance receptacle outlet circuit. (two wires hooked together under the same SQ-D breaker is only one circuit)

I see the 85? and sunny. What are you trying to do rub it in? Right now it's -4? here on its way down to -10?. And to add to that the packers lost.

 

[Rick Christopherson]

This is a internet posted pic.

This is a high resolution picture that you can zoom in on it quite a bit. It isn't what it appears. The refrigerator is on the first breaker. The dishwasher is on the second breaker (alone). The kitchen A is on the 3rd breaker, and the red wire is on the 4th breaker, which is only partially visible.

When you zoom in, notice how the first two wires are visible above the plastic molding of the breaker terminal, but the third wire is not above this same piece. That's because it is on a different breaker.

 

[macmikeman]

I see the 85? and sunny. What are you trying to do rub it in? Right now it's -4? here on its way down to -10?. And to add to that the packers lost.

that has been my signature line here for a number of years now. I leave it up all year..

 

[Smart $]

... It isn't what it appears. The refrigerator is on the first breaker. The dishwasher is on the second breaker (alone). The kitchen A is on the 3rd breaker, and the red wire is on the 4th breaker, which is only partially visible. ...

I agree, except spaces 6 and 8 are occupied by a 2P breaker.

 

[jxofaltrds]

This is a high resolution picture that you can zoom in on it quite a bit. It isn't what it appears. The refrigerator is on the first breaker. The dishwasher is on the second breaker (alone). The kitchen A is on the 3rd breaker, and the red wire is on the 4th breaker, which is only partially visible.

When you zoom in, notice how the first two wires are visible above the plastic molding of the breaker terminal, but the third wire is not above this same piece. That's because it is on a different breaker.

I agree, except spaces 6 and 8 are occupied by a 2P breaker.

I need better glasses. TY:slaphead:

 

[mjf]

I agree, except spaces 6 and 8 are occupied by a 2P breaker.

Probably a MWBC (red and black wires) I put them on 2pole breakers all the time.

 

[templdl]

that has been my signature line here for a number of years now. I leave it up all year..

A slight correction, it's -12? this morning. Relocating to Payson, Az is looking more attractive.

 

[petersonra]

-17F here.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Are the lugs rated for 2 wires on the neutral bar? It appears there are multiple equipment grounding conductor under one screw.

 

[mwm1752]

Most ground busses will let you connect more than 1 grounding conductor but limit you to 1 grounded conductor under individual lugs( manufacture instructions wouls validate). Looks like circuits 2 & 4 are proper & 6 & 8 are isolated to a 2 pole breaker -- no violation seen with limited info

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Most ground busses will let you connect more than 1 grounding conductor but limit you to 1 grounded conductor under individual lugs( manufacture instructions wouls validate). Looks like circuits 2 & 4 are proper & 6 & 8 are isolated to a 2 pole breaker -- no violation seen with limited info

That is true with newer panel but not necessarily with older ones

 

[mwm1752]

That is true with newer panel but not necessarily with older ones

I'm pretty sure Sq D Grd buss have allowed it for at least 25 years -- to long ago to remember the precise moment that tibit fact was learned, sometimes 24 hrs can be difficult - I would be thinking Zinsco or FPE would be in the catagory of older types

 

[kwired]

that has been my signature line here for a number of years now. I leave it up all year..

It is seldom wrong, especially when comparing the accuracy to single digits or even negative numbers.

Are the lugs rated for 2 wires on the neutral bar? It appears there are multiple equipment grounding conductor under one screw.

That is true with newer panel but not necessarily with older ones

All Square D panels of the vintage using that style of main have had ground/neutral bus bars rated for more than one conductor, and it has been around for at least 25-30 years now.

 

[kwired]

This is a high resolution picture that you can zoom in on it quite a bit. It isn't what it appears. The refrigerator is on the first breaker. The dishwasher is on the second breaker (alone). The kitchen A is on the 3rd breaker, and the red wire is on the 4th breaker, which is only partially visible.

When you zoom in, notice how the first two wires are visible above the plastic molding of the breaker terminal, but the third wire is not above this same piece. That's because it is on a different breaker.

Lets say the conductors are on the breakers as OP had assumed, still nothing wrong with branching out in a different direction than the "multiwire" portion of the circuit. The installer could have easily ran a three wire cable to a junction box, continued the three wire on and tapped a two wire out of the junction box and most would not question that - yet is effectively the same thing.

 

[kwired]

I do agree the dishwasher can not be on same pole of a MWBC that is also supplying small appliance branch circuits, but can still be part of a MWBC with SABC on the other pole.