lighting outlet

[Jim W in Tampa]

look at the definition of outlet also

another neat one to look at is LUMINAIRE

 

[mpd]

or utilization equipment, your turn

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

or utilization equipment, your turn

Sounds a bit like a ceiling fan

 

[roger]

MPD, there is no NEC requirement to have a fixture installed on a "Lighting Outlet" in a bedroom. The definition of "Lighting Outlet" makes this clear.

Lighting Outlet. An outlet intended for the direct connection of a lampholder, a luminaire (lighting fixture), or a pendant cord terminating in a lampholder.

It is an "Outlet" intended for a fixture, that's all

In contrast let's look at the definition of a "Receptacle Outlet"

Receptacle Outlet. An outlet where one or more receptacles are installed.

If a fixture were necessary for a "Lighting Outlet" to be a "Lighting Outlet" it would be worded the same as the definition of the "Receptacle Outlet" which requires a Receptacle to be installed.

Roger

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

I seriously hope your a better inspector than that.So far you cited no code violation #

 

[mpd]

jim w

most plans I review never show a blank plate, where a required lighting outlet is, I have never had an issue with it, I could always cite not in my town or 90.4, (I'm joking before anybody goes off the deep end)

 

[iwire]

(I'm joking before anybody goes off the deep end)

LOL

90.4 is a dangerous subject 'round here

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

jim w

most plans I review never show a blank plate, where a required lighting outlet is, I have never had an issue with it, I could always cite not in my town or 90.4, (I'm joking before anybody goes off the deep end)

If a commercial job your right it most likely will spec a fixture.But in homes it often just says rough in for a fan/light.You are getting away with too much if they havnt called you down on this yet.I agree nec should require a fixture but it simply doesnt and i have blanked thousands

 

[celtic]

I agree nec should require a fixture ...

Even on a switched recept?

 

[mpd]

jim w

I am not getting away with anything, I have never had an issue with it, all the plans I review may show a future fan, but they also show a switched outlet and not by my request,

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

jim w

I am not getting away with anything, I have never had an issue with it, all the plans I review may show a future fan, but they also show a switched outlet and not by my request,

Just where are you at ? Not florida i am sure

 

[allenwayne]

210.70 A 1 - At least one lighting outlet shall be installed in every habitable room and bathroom.

Lighting outlet - An outlet intended for the direct connection of a lampholder, a luminare a (lighting fixture) or a pendant cord terminating in a fixture.

Nowhere does it allow a ceiling fan WITHOUT a lamp holder to be installed in lieu of a luminare/lampholder/pendant cord terminating in a lampholder.The lighting outlet is specifically intended for just what the terminoligy says some type of light.A ceiling fan without a lampholder doen`t qualify for a light in that room.
I believe the intention was to ensure that there is a switch controlled light within the habitable room be it a switched receptacle or a ceiling fixture of some type.
Our inspectors require some type of light within a room or a switched receptacle in lieu of.Take a powder bath, just one wall fixture.The homeowner will be supplying there own in this case.To pass a final we supply a cheap keyless lampholder in order to pass.If in a bathroom and there is a shower light,then we can simply blank off the lighting outlet.Dining room either a fixture or again a keyless.Same for entry, hallway, any habitable space must have some type of light installed or we don`t pass period.

 

[al hildenbrand]

If we took other factors into many of our discussions, there would be a lot of moot points.

John,

I was busy yesterday. Today, I want to say how much I appreciated the laugh you gave me back on page 13, post #127.

 

[al hildenbrand]

It says outlet not fixture so cite my violation number

Jim,

You know better.

Lighting outlet. Not outlet.

 

[al hildenbrand]

. . . in homes it often just says rough in for a fan/light. . . nec should require a fixture but it simply doesnt and i have blanked thousands

And, by your post earlier, the local lighting store comes and installs the luminaires.

I infer from your statements, that local licensing laws don't extend to hard wired utilization equipment, that is, that anyone can do it and the AHJ is not required to be involved.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

And, by your post earlier, the local lighting store comes and installs the luminaires.

I infer from your statements, that local licensing laws don't extend to hard wired utilization equipment, that is, that anyone can do it and the AHJ is not required to be involved.

Our licensing system is a joke.They could care less who does the actual work as long as there is a master to pull a permit.Your new home could have been and likely was wired by $10 romex monkeys straight out of high school with perhaps if your lucky one man with ability of a journeyman on the job.Its a total joke.After the final with blanks or keyless i can guarantee nobody will pull another permit to install the real fixtures.Had the delivery man that delivered my new frig tell me that he subcontracts with big orange and he installs microwaves ,diswashers,etc.Are you scared yet ?In short anything that was allowed to be blanked off will never get inspected.But who cares,the total final electric is done without power in 10 minutes or less.And 50% or more remodels never get permitted.I did some for an x boss that were major rewires,plumbing,framing,and no permit ever pulled.You almost never hear of them getting busted.

 

[mpd]

jim w

I am glad I am not an inspector in florida, from what it sounds like, why even bother having inspectors, sounds like the whole system needs to be overhauled

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

jim w

I am glad I am not an inspector in florida, from what it sounds like, why even bother having inspectors, sounds like the whole system needs to be overhauled

It does and paychecks would get normal.But to many fighting to not fix.If jobs required a journeyman with card on each job monday this state would be shut down.

 

[JohnE]

John,

I was busy yesterday. Today, I want to say how much I appreciated the laugh you gave me back on page 13, post #127.

My pleasure, Al!

 

[allenwayne]

It does and paychecks would get normal.But to many fighting to not fix.If jobs required a journeyman with card on each job monday this state would be shut down.

Jim about a few years ago I saw an add in the st pete times that read (Wanted 20 romex rangers)I thought what in the heck is a romex ranger ????)
Then I found out a romex ranger is a low paid employee that pulls NM from point a to point b without knowing what it does.There is a very large EC in this state that sends 3 maybe 4 trucks to a home sure they wire it fast but the individuals only know i pull 3 wire from here to here.Or 2 wire from here to here.It`s a sad state of affairs.Gone are the days that require a journeyman on each and every job.Now as long as the master electrician that holds the license for the shop files the permit anybody can do the work here.The license holder doesn`t have to come to the shop just supply the license # and stay home !!!!!! Sad but true...............