Preforming my first live service changeout

[ty]

Dennis, IMO this is backwards and dangerous

Dennis' way is exactly how it should be done.

That's why I asked in an earlier post how the OP was going to do it.


Now, if the power co requires temp or permanent re-connect, depends on how to do it.
We always use H-Taps. even for temp hook-ups.
They are a permanent connection and, unlike the use of tomic connectors, they won't be loose until the permanent re-connect is done.

Some Power Co's here require a permanent reconnect (with H-Taps, not Fargos), while others will change whatever taps you install (even if you use H-Taps), and others will not allow you to do the re-connect.



I will state that if You (the OP) are an apprentice, You should NOT be doing this yourself.

 

[ty]

Why wouldn't you put the meter in after you make the connections?

Who knows?

Not only should the meter be out, but a continuity test should be done before the re-connect, and a continuity test should be done before plugging in the meter, with main breaker in OFF position.

 

[mivey]

My method is by no means the only way.

It is for me.

 

[iwire]

here come the osha police...

Todd I find your response unprofessional, I do know there is a real world out there but wanting people to make it home at night is not a bad thing.

http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/docs/98-131/epidemi.html#fig7

A total of 5,348 workers were electrocuted in 5,180 incidents from 1980 through 1992. One-hundred fifty-three (3%) of the fatal incidents resulted in multiple fatalities: 140 incidents involved 2 victims each, 11 incidents involved 3 victims each, and 2 incidents involved 4 victims each.

An average of 411 workers were electrocuted each year, with an average annual rate of 0.4 per 100,000 workers. Figure 1 provides the frequency and rate per 100,000 workers of electrocutions by year of death. The substantial decrease is noteworthy, but it varies by industry. While total work-related fatalities decreased 23% from 1980 to 1989,24 the number of electrocution deaths have decreased by more than 50% from 1980 to 1992.

Frequencies of Electrocution Deaths Identified by FACE by Industry, 1982-1994

Frequencies of Electrocution Deaths Identified by FACE by Age Group, 1982-1994

Frequencies of Electrocution Deaths Identified by FACE by Occupation, 1982-1994

Frequencies of Electrocution Incidents Identified by FACE by Low Voltage Level (<600 Volts), 1982-1994

Maybe all those that were electrocuted at work deserved it and their families where happy about it.

Just something to consider, to each their own.

 

[cschmid]

here you call POCO and make an appointment then make new mast and pull old one down and put new one up and they disconnect and reconnect. and they normally pull the fuse on the transformewr when they do it..

 

[flashlight]

here you call POCO and make an appointment then make new mast and pull old one down and put new one up and they disconnect and reconnect. and they normally pull the fuse on the transformewr when they do it..

This is the civilized way to do it !

When doing hot, I do as Dennis says, put grounded conductor far out of way and do last.

 

[Bobhook149]

Dennis' way is exactly how it should be done.

That's why I asked in an earlier post how the OP was going to do it.


Now, if the power co requires temp or permanent re-connect, depends on how to do it.
We always use H-Taps. even for temp hook-ups.
They are a permanent connection and, unlike the use of tomic connectors, they won't be loose until the permanent re-connect is done.

Some Power Co's here require a permanent reconnect (with H-Taps, not Fargos), while others will change whatever taps you install (even if you use H-Taps), and others will not allow you to do the re-connect.


I will state that if You (the OP) are an apprentice, You should NOT be doing this yourself.

I'm doing this with the company i work for, i'm 4th year and almost time for my license i need to learn how to do it. My boss will guide me and be there with me but thought i would pick the brain of the forum. Looking for some good technique thats all.

Thanks

 

[hardworkingstiff]

I've seen it many times. Why give the POCO your bugs?

Their not mine, I sold them to the customer.

 

[iwire]

Their not mine, I sold them to the customer.

I love short answers that say so much.

 

[1793]

I'm doing this with the company i work for, i'm 4th year and almost time for my license i need to learn how to do it. My boss will guide me and be there with me but thought i would pick the brain of the forum. Looking for some good technique thats all.

Thanks

From IWIRE in another thread, http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?t=122942&highlight=service+change
If you are an employee of an electrical contractor OSHA prohibits you from doing that work hot at all even with proper PPE. (Yeah I know we all do it or have done it)

If you are the owner of the company OSHA does not apply to you at all.
__________________
Bob

Yes, OSHA will not allow electrians to do that work hot no matter what order you do it.
Quote:
1910.333(a)(1)

"Deenergized parts." Live parts to which an employee may be exposed shall be deenergized before the employee works on or near them, unless the employer can demonstrate that deenergizing introduces additional or increased hazards or is infeasible due to equipment design or operational limitations. Live parts that operate at less than 50 volts to ground need not be deenergized if there will be no increased exposure to electrical burns or to explosion due to electric arcs.

Note 1: Examples of increased or additional hazards include interruption of life support equipment, deactivation of emergency alarm systems, shutdown of hazardous location ventilation equipment, or removal of illumination for an area.

Note 2: Examples of work that may be performed on or near energized circuit parts because of infeasibility due to equipment design or operational limitations include testing of electric circuits that can only be performed with the circuit energized and work on circuits that form an integral part of a continuous industrial process in a chemical plant that would otherwise need to be completely shut down in order to permit work on one circuit or piece of equipment.

Note 3: Work on or near deenergized parts is covered by paragraph (b) of this section.

 

[ty]

Todd I find your response unprofessional, I do know there is a real world out there but wanting people to make it home at night is not a bad thing.

Sorry, BOB, if you feel that way.
But, you know the responses these threads generate. There will be a whole 82 pages on how and why we aren't supposed to perform this task. You say unprofessional, I say frustrated.

I can't find the past threads that I was looking for, (I guess the archived forums are no longer viewable).
I have stated this in those past threads:
We have some Power Co's around here that REQUIRE the Electrician to do the reconnect.
Right, wrong, or indifferent, that's the way it is.

If the OP is being trained to do the re-connect, then I can offer some pointers, as I am trained in this and other Utility work.

Maybe all those that were electrocuted at work deserved it and their families where happy about it.
Just something to consider, to each their own.

For the record: Nobody deserves to be Electrocuted at work.


Here's something to concider:
why not, everytime a 'live work' type of thread is started, just delete it and end the endless pages of debate and commentary.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

Their not mine, I sold them to the customer.

I love short answers that say so much.

Yea, like I don't know the difference between "their" and "they're". Geesh, I really should have stayed awake in English class.

 

[ceb58]

All three are not dangerous. They are potentially dangerous. Just take the potential out of it. It is easier to loose one wire and have it accidentally touch the bare neutral that is right in the way.

My method is by no means the only way. Whatever suits your fancy.

My fancy is to call poco and let them do it.

 

[wirenut601]

service change out

service change out

I ve got a few things for ya dont do it , get some one who knows what they are doing from what i see you dont and your an app. not something to be done on your own any IMO. also not sure about the east coast but here in illinois we dont touch any thing top side of meter to pole unless it is over head drop then we set riser and run wire through whether head poco dose terms and determs big fines here. hate to see some one hurt exspecially apprentices just my feelings.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

I mostly do atypical electrical work (and no residential in over 30 years), but I've heard tell that a lot of overhead service changes are now done by pulling the meter, taking a hot fed meterbase off the wall, installing all the new stuff and feeding the new service from the old still hot meterbase, jumping out the new meterbase and leaving the meter in the old meterbase. Is that doable?

 

[nrp3]

Thats the way I have always done it. Thats here, with our POCO rules, may not work elsewhere.

 

[iwire]

There will be a whole 82 pages on how and why we aren't supposed to perform this task. You say unprofessional, I say frustrated.

So do not read the thread that frustrates you.

I have stated this in those past threads:
We have some Power Co's around here that REQUIRE the Electrician to do the reconnect.
Right, wrong, or indifferent, that's the way it is.

Does that make it any less dangerous?

Does that make it any less of a costly OSHA fine if someone was to get caught?

Perhaps you could start sending the safety person at the local power company the OSHA sections?

If the OP is being trained to do the re-connect, then I can offer some pointers, as I am trained in this and other Utility work.

I am also 'trained' it is still a direct OSHA violation. Have I done it? Sure of course I have, many times. It does not make it right and a newbie should be presented with all the facts. We should not be telling newbies that hot work is expected of them, that starts them off in the wrong direction just like you and I where.

For the record: Nobody deserves to be Electrocuted at work.

But you see no reason to try to lower the count?

Here's something to concider:
why not, everytime a 'live work' type of thread is started, just delete it and end the endless pages of debate and commentary.

Why not let them run their course and let newbies see there are many differing opinions about hot work.

 

[nrp3]

Which makes me wonder if I am the owner/sole employee, am I subject to these OSHA rules/fines?

 

[iwire]

Which makes me wonder if I am the owner/sole employee, am I subject to these OSHA rules/fines?

No they do not apply to the employer at all, only employees.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

...
Yes, OSHA will not allow electrians to do that work hot no matter what order you do it.
Quote:
1910.333(a)(1)

"Deenergized parts." Live parts to which an employee may be exposed shall be deenergized before the employee works on or near them, unless the employer can demonstrate that deenergizing introduces additional or increased hazards or is infeasible due to equipment design or operational limitations. Live parts that operate at less than 50 volts to ground need not be deenergized if there will be no increased exposure to electrical burns or to explosion due to electric arcs.

Note 1: Examples of increased or additional hazards include interruption of life support equipment, deactivation of emergency alarm systems, shutdown of hazardous location ventilation equipment, or removal of illumination for an area.

Note 2: Examples of work that may be performed on or near energized circuit parts because of infeasibility due to equipment design or operational limitations include testing of electric circuits that can only be performed with the circuit energized and work on circuits that form an integral part of a continuous industrial process in a chemical plant that would otherwise need to be completely shut down in order to permit work on one circuit or piece of equipment.

Note 3: Work on or near deenergized parts is covered by paragraph (b) of this section.

If you are saying that this section of the OSHA rules permits live work to hook-up a residential service, I don't agree with you.